Dyche In/Out

[wassy04]

It really isn't my style to want to hound people out or overly blame specific people but I honestly think it might be best to get rid of Dyche in this case - his affection for the club, he might even fall on his sword to an extent to minimise the financial implications. Even taking into account the ridiculousness of having a 4th manager in a single season! I'd seriously try to 'rescue' Glasner from CP, though I understand that might be unrealistic. We could even bend to some clause where if certain teams come for him in the summer, he can go. I personally don't understand the want for Silva but he would probably be quite easy to get in comparison. If nobody we actually want to take us forward for a few seasons is available, I would totally put a caretaker in because I think Dyche has coached us worse. I would even take Southgate, just because he is a good man manager, which is what I think we need.

We got a new manager bounce when Dyche came in - linking back to what McForest said, the last 3 managers have all got their style and the players have to confirm to that. So basically, in my opinion, we got a good bounce when Dyche came in because he didn't have time to put his methods on the squad yet and the players basically had a lot more freedom to play their natural game......and we played ok and got some points.

Now, he has had the time to squash them into his system and we simply don't have the players for it. It can be effective, but not with what we have, they just don't suit him. And I really don't want us to try and buy players for his system, it's not the direction I think we should be going in.

I do wish people would stop suggesting Glasner etc would come, I know you did say it would be unrealistic. It has a 0% chance, Glasner will go for a better team than us and wouldn't be available mid-season anyway. We tried for Silva after Ange and he said he wouldn't leave mid season. Southgate is not taking this job.

It's fine to suggest Dyche should go, it has been rough. However, a caretaker manager will be Andy Reid or someone like that. Or someone like Jesse Marsh or Big Sam or worse.

Two questions, do you honestly think one of those guys will do better than Dyche? Do you think it harms our chances of a better manager in the summer?

Managers aren't stupid, just because they get offered a wad of cash doesn't mean they are going to jump at a team that will likely sack them after a few months if they don't start well. (although maybe you're just happy with the payout) If we have four managers in one year, what are the chances of just one the following year?

If there was even a 0.5% chance, why not try with Glasner. He's done at Palace, he's slagging the ownership off, who might decide they'd take some money for him like they seem to be doing with all their players. He might then be happy with a 6 month contract or a form of break clause, sod it, why not. He gets a chance to enhance his reputation even more by competing for the Europa and steering us safe from relegation. Rob Edwards went from Boro to Wolves for almost guaranteed relegation and Boro potential promotion, go figure!? I'm glad I don't have your attitude with my own business. 

We are still a very good opportunity for someone. An ambitious owner who backs his manager with players. The opportunity to win the second competition in Europe and qualify for the Champions League!! Hopefully an upgraded stadium coming. Some excellent players, albeit maybe a slightly average squad (though I think we are now underachieving having overachieved last season). 

I would be happy to have Andy take the reins to be honest, pretty much anyone.

As I said, I am not someone who likes to push things on individuals, I think the world operates in grey rather than the black and white of internet opinions. However, I think in this case, Dyche is actively harming our chances of staying up. I think the team could come together and decide how to play without a manager or coach and be more successful. 

Basically, in answer to your direct questions, I think yes, those guys would do better than Dyche. And no, I do not think it would harm our chances of a better manager in the summer. I think relegation will have a significantly bigger effect on that, which I think is a serious possibility if we maintain the status quo.

Ha my attitude of not being willing to suggest something that definitely won't happen? The suggestion of Glasner is akin to suggesting Semenyo or Eze or Thiago would come to Forest. He's already at a better team that is competing in Europe. Plus we tried for these guys last time and were knocked back, hence having to settle for Dyche. What's changed since we appointed Dyche that makes you think we can suddenly attract someone better?

It would be someone like Rafa or a caretaker if not. 

I would rather the devil you know, than the one you don't. I think Dyche is more likely to keep us up than the presumed alternative of a caretaker personally. Fair play if you think otherwise, I hope if Dyche stays I'm right and if he goes you're right!

[Sniffer Dog (Admin)]

I will make this as simple as possible.


We have a decent enough squad who are underperforming because we have a shyte coach.

[Salvatore Matrecano]

I will make this as simple as possible.


We have a decent enough squad who are underperforming because we have a shyte coach.

We have 11 PL quality players who were here last season who are being ground into the dirt.
We have 2-3 new additions who are trying their best.
The rest of the squad are nowhere near the level.
That does not excuse what I saw last night which was an unacceptable performance from both players and coaching staff.

[ormerdonkey]

Sean really needs this job more than we need him. If he can’t get a tune out of this squad and we stay up I can’t see him being here next season and it will just confirm what everyone thinks of him and his approach to football.

Glasner is not going to happen, I reckon he’ll be at Spurs once they ditch Frank and that probably the main reason Parish kept him after their tiff was for any small amount of compensation they might be entitled to

[wassy04]

I will make this as simple as possible.


We have a decent enough squad who are underperforming  because we have a shyte coach.

I'm not sure it's as decent as some think but I agree they are underperforming and we have a shite coach yes.

Question is, what are the chances of us landing a less shite coach and are they more or less likely to keep us up. 

If that is possible and it improves our chances, great. Personally I don't think we can land anyone any better and it'll more likely get even worse with a caretaker/randomer. 

Remember we had another manager this season and they did even worse with the same group than Dyche! Ange even had Wood still too.

[wassy04]

Sean really needs this job more than we need him. If he can’t get a tune out of this squad and we stay up I can’t see him being here next season and it will just confirm what everyone thinks of him and his approach to football.

Glasner is not going to happen, I reckon he’ll be at Spurs once they ditch Frank and that probably the main reason Parish kept him after their tiff was for any small amount of compensation they might be entitled to

I reckon he's going for the Man Utd job, they've been interested for a while. Although would be very Utd to go for Carrick if he has a solid finish to the season.

[Salvatore Matrecano]

Decent enough squad? Lets name names

Not good enough
Victor
Morato
Boly
Savona (harsh but true)
Zinchenko
McAtee
Bakwa
Awoniyi

Injured
Wood
Luiz (may as well be injured because we can’t play him)

Try hard but not at the level
Ndoye
Jesus (never a lone CF)
Probably add Yates to that

Still hoping
Jair Cunha
Hutchinson
Lucca (please be decent)

Thats 12 out of 25 who arent starters. 3 Im hoping will turn out good. Its not enough to sustain 2 competitions

The caveat is I would expect a League 2 team to have made a better fight of it than we made last night.

[Woan]

Our problems started the day Edu walked through the door. Everything leads to that point.

Edu is a convenient scapegoat but as SM has (correctly) said it's not all down to him.

And why did Nuno take such umbrage to him being brought in? It's not like it was done cloak and dagger - his arrival was being reported for months before it was confirmed.

Im convinced Nuno’s thing with Edu was mostly a red herring and an excuse for him when he’d already decided he wanted out. That he got a pay rise the previous month was a Brucey bonus. That on pitch spat with EM was the moment.

I can see that, however if I was guessing how it played out. I think he signed a new contract somewhat reluctantly at the end of the season, got offered a payrise and a 200m war chest to make amends. Then doesn't get any say in how that money is spent and he doesn't like the players we're after, maybe doesn't think they will fit the system or wants more experience or whatever. Then he's not even allowed to sign a cheap backup winger in Traore and it breaks him and he decides to try and change things, which was always unlikely and so is sacked. 

So less of a falling out of personality, more of a not getting his way and deciding he wanted out before it went downhill to protect his own reputation. Maybe he thought his stock was really high after last year and he could leverage that into a role with more control over transfers. Not sure it was a great move really, seeing where he ended up!

All of you make valid points. Do any of you think that after the on-field confrontation with EM, the final straw for Nuno may have come from Edu and EM demanding a new and different playing style? It may explain his bad feelings toward Edu. It's just such an odd situation.

[Jimmygordon]

Its clear EM is waiting for Silva.

[Redreg]

Decent enough squad? Lets name names

Not good enough
Victor
Morato
Boly
Savona (harsh but true)
Zinchenko
McAtee
Bakwa
Awoniyi

Injured
Wood
Luiz (may as well be injured because we can’t play him)

Try hard but not at the level
Ndoye
Jesus (never a lone CF)
Probably add Yates to that

Still hoping
Jair Cunha
Hutchinson
Lucca (please be decent)

Thats 12 out of 25 who arent starters. 3 Im hoping will turn out good. Its not enough to sustain 2 competitions

The caveat is I would expect a League 2 team to have made a better fight of it than we made last night.

Think Mcatee comes good with right manager. Agree with all others would happily sell Ndoye if we can recoup fee .

[Salvatore Matrecano]

McAtee in my opinion looks good playing for Celtic where the team dominates the opposition. He can’t do any kind of physical battle or a situation where we don’t have the ball. That said the little bit we saw last night he made some genuinely good passes, trouble was there was so little of it.

[wassy04]

McAtee in my opinion looks good playing for Celtic where the team dominates the opposition. He can’t do any kind of physical battle or a situation where we don’t have the ball. That said the little bit we saw last night he made some genuinely good passes, trouble was there was so little of it.

Maybe our next manager will aim for a more possession based style of play.