Dyche In/Out

[Salvatore Matrecano]

Our problems started the day Edu walked through the door. Everything leads to that point.

Edu is a convenient scapegoat but as SM has (correctly) said it's not all down to him.

And why did Nuno take such umbrage to him being brought in? It's not like it was done cloak and dagger - his arrival was being reported for months before it was confirmed.

Im convinced Nuno’s thing with Edu was mostly a red herring and an excuse for him when he’d already decided he wanted out. That he got a pay rise the previous month was a Brucey bonus. That on pitch spat with EM was the moment.

[wassy04]

Our problems started the day Edu walked through the door. Everything leads to that point.

Edu is a convenient scapegoat but as SM has (correctly) said it's not all down to him.

And why did Nuno take such umbrage to him being brought in? It's not like it was done cloak and dagger - his arrival was being reported for months before it was confirmed.

Im convinced Nuno’s thing with Edu was mostly a red herring and an excuse for him when he’d already decided he wanted out. That he got a pay rise the previous month was a Brucey bonus. That on pitch spat with EM was the moment.

I can see that, however if I was guessing how it played out. I think he signed a new contract somewhat reluctantly at the end of the season, got offered a payrise and a 200m war chest to make amends. Then doesn't get any say in how that money is spent and he doesn't like the players we're after, maybe doesn't think they will fit the system or wants more experience or whatever. Then he's not even allowed to sign a cheap backup winger in Traore and it breaks him and he decides to try and change things, which was always unlikely and so is sacked. 

So less of a falling out of personality, more of a not getting his way and deciding he wanted out before it went downhill to protect his own reputation. Maybe he thought his stock was really high after last year and he could leverage that into a role with more control over transfers. Not sure it was a great move really, seeing where he ended up!

[Shawoddyred]

It really isn't my style to want to hound people out or overly blame specific people but I honestly think it might be best to get rid of Dyche in this case - his affection for the club, he might even fall on his sword to an extent to minimise the financial implications. Even taking into account the ridiculousness of having a 4th manager in a single season! I'd seriously try to 'rescue' Glasner from CP, though I understand that might be unrealistic. We could even bend to some clause where if certain teams come for him in the summer, he can go. I personally don't understand the want for Silva but he would probably be quite easy to get in comparison. If nobody we actually want to take us forward for a few seasons is available, I would totally put a caretaker in because I think Dyche has coached us worse. I would even take Southgate, just because he is a good man manager, which is what I think we need.

We got a new manager bounce when Dyche came in - linking back to what McForest said, the last 3 managers have all got their style and the players have to confirm to that. So basically, in my opinion, we got a good bounce when Dyche came in because he didn't have time to put his methods on the squad yet and the players basically had a lot more freedom to play their natural game......and we played ok and got some points.

Now, he has had the time to squash them into his system and we simply don't have the players for it. It can be effective, but not with what we have, they just don't suit him. And I really don't want us to try and buy players for his system, it's not the direction I think we should be going in.

[Chicago]

Still better than Ange but that is not saying much.

It really comes down to surviving this season and seeing what the transfer window brings. Seems like a decent bloke who wants the best for the team but nothing is gelling. Getting another manager now will probably be suicide. in Retrospect we should have kept Nuno's staff and promoted his second in command as the players liked them and they liked the situation in Nottingham. That at least would have allowed continuity. Wood being buggered is a huge hit. I like Jesus but he is plowing a lone furrow. Hopefully Lucca has more link up play. The disconnect between the midfield and the forward play is a major issue. Obviously we would all like Dyche to succeed. The football is megsonesque at the moment but at least he isn't Megson who did more damage at forest than anyone I can remember.

Footballers want to win. The want to be coached. I am sure they aren't downing tools. They seem low on confidence which is kind of weird after the good battling performance against Arsenal. We do need fast, physical forward players though. And link up play between the back and the front. This means our most important players are actually Murillo and Dominguez.

Since PSR goes bye bye in the summer and Chris is on 100K a week so that will be off the books so we need to go for it this January. At least give Dyche some tools to give it a go. Sacking him now will probably be the final nail in the coffin for this year. i am guessing Marco Silva in the summer with possinly Harry Wilson. This is of course if we manage to stay up. I still contend that Wet Sham are rubbish and we only ourselves to blame if we don't achieve safety by wallowing in our own self pity.

Chicago: Holding on.

[toddy]

if he walks he never gets another job. to keep his reputation as a firefighter he needs to keep us up, then he will allways find a club that needs to avoid the drop

[wassy04]

It really isn't my style to want to hound people out or overly blame specific people but I honestly think it might be best to get rid of Dyche in this case - his affection for the club, he might even fall on his sword to an extent to minimise the financial implications. Even taking into account the ridiculousness of having a 4th manager in a single season! I'd seriously try to 'rescue' Glasner from CP, though I understand that might be unrealistic. We could even bend to some clause where if certain teams come for him in the summer, he can go. I personally don't understand the want for Silva but he would probably be quite easy to get in comparison. If nobody we actually want to take us forward for a few seasons is available, I would totally put a caretaker in because I think Dyche has coached us worse. I would even take Southgate, just because he is a good man manager, which is what I think we need.

We got a new manager bounce when Dyche came in - linking back to what McForest said, the last 3 managers have all got their style and the players have to confirm to that. So basically, in my opinion, we got a good bounce when Dyche came in because he didn't have time to put his methods on the squad yet and the players basically had a lot more freedom to play their natural game......and we played ok and got some points.

Now, he has had the time to squash them into his system and we simply don't have the players for it. It can be effective, but not with what we have, they just don't suit him. And I really don't want us to try and buy players for his system, it's not the direction I think we should be going in.

I do wish people would stop suggesting Glasner etc would come, I know you did say it would be unrealistic. It has a 0% chance, Glasner will go for a better team than us and wouldn't be available mid-season anyway. We tried for Silva after Ange and he said he wouldn't leave mid season. Southgate is not taking this job.

It's fine to suggest Dyche should go, it has been rough. However, a caretaker manager will be Andy Reid or someone like that. Or someone like Jesse Marsh or Big Sam or worse.

Two questions, do you honestly think one of those guys will do better than Dyche? Do you think it harms our chances of a better manager in the summer?

Managers aren't stupid, just because they get offered a wad of cash doesn't mean they are going to jump at a team that will likely sack them after a few months if they don't start well. (although maybe you're just happy with the payout) If we have four managers in one year, what are the chances of just one the following year?

[Shawoddyred]

It really isn't my style to want to hound people out or overly blame specific people but I honestly think it might be best to get rid of Dyche in this case - his affection for the club, he might even fall on his sword to an extent to minimise the financial implications. Even taking into account the ridiculousness of having a 4th manager in a single season! I'd seriously try to 'rescue' Glasner from CP, though I understand that might be unrealistic. We could even bend to some clause where if certain teams come for him in the summer, he can go. I personally don't understand the want for Silva but he would probably be quite easy to get in comparison. If nobody we actually want to take us forward for a few seasons is available, I would totally put a caretaker in because I think Dyche has coached us worse. I would even take Southgate, just because he is a good man manager, which is what I think we need.

We got a new manager bounce when Dyche came in - linking back to what McForest said, the last 3 managers have all got their style and the players have to confirm to that. So basically, in my opinion, we got a good bounce when Dyche came in because he didn't have time to put his methods on the squad yet and the players basically had a lot more freedom to play their natural game......and we played ok and got some points.

Now, he has had the time to squash them into his system and we simply don't have the players for it. It can be effective, but not with what we have, they just don't suit him. And I really don't want us to try and buy players for his system, it's not the direction I think we should be going in.

I do wish people would stop suggesting Glasner etc would come, I know you did say it would be unrealistic. It has a 0% chance, Glasner will go for a better team than us and wouldn't be available mid-season anyway. We tried for Silva after Ange and he said he wouldn't leave mid season. Southgate is not taking this job.

It's fine to suggest Dyche should go, it has been rough. However, a caretaker manager will be Andy Reid or someone like that. Or someone like Jesse Marsh or Big Sam or worse.

Two questions, do you honestly think one of those guys will do better than Dyche? Do you think it harms our chances of a better manager in the summer?

Managers aren't stupid, just because they get offered a wad of cash doesn't mean they are going to jump at a team that will likely sack them after a few months if they don't start well. (although maybe you're just happy with the payout) If we have four managers in one year, what are the chances of just one the following year?

If there was even a 0.5% chance, why not try with Glasner. He's done at Palace, he's slagging the ownership off, who might decide they'd take some money for him like they seem to be doing with all their players. He might then be happy with a 6 month contract or a form of break clause, sod it, why not. He gets a chance to enhance his reputation even more by competing for the Europa and steering us safe from relegation. Rob Edwards went from Boro to Wolves for almost guaranteed relegation and Boro potential promotion, go figure!? I'm glad I don't have your attitude with my own business. 

We are still a very good opportunity for someone. An ambitious owner who backs his manager with players. The opportunity to win the second competition in Europe and qualify for the Champions League!! Hopefully an upgraded stadium coming. Some excellent players, albeit maybe a slightly average squad (though I think we are now underachieving having overachieved last season). 

I would be happy to have Andy take the reins to be honest, pretty much anyone.

As I said, I am not someone who likes to push things on individuals, I think the world operates in grey rather than the black and white of internet opinions. However, I think in this case, Dyche is actively harming our chances of staying up. I think the team could come together and decide how to play without a manager or coach and be more successful. 

Basically, in answer to your direct questions, I think yes, those guys would do better than Dyche. And no, I do not think it would harm our chances of a better manager in the summer. I think relegation will have a significantly bigger effect on that, which I think is a serious possibility if we maintain the status quo.

[Paplane]

Our problems started the day Edu walked through the door. Everything leads to that point.

They started after Leicester at home last season Pap which was a long time before Edu walked through the door.

Ange and Dyche were not Edu's choices either dedpite what some want to believe and some have reported.

Was that performance last night Edu's fault?

Yes! He bought the wrong £35m striker in the summer who he then got binned off in full knowledge that the only remaining striker was knackered. Last night's performance was entirely down to Edu and his bad decision making and shite eye for a player.

[Sausage Roll]

Your dislike for Edu seems a bit over the top Pap. What has he ever done to you?

Or should I call you 'Nuno?'

:Funny:

[Paplane]

Your dislike for Edu seems a bit over the top Pap. What has he ever done to you?

Or should I call you 'Nuno?'

:Funny:

Bought a load of S**t players and fallen out, resulting in the loss, of a manager who very nearly got us qualified for the champions league?

I have nothing to base this on but I my perception is he came in giving it the billy big bollox and everything he's touched has turned to shite.

[Sniffer Dog (Admin)]

I think your imagination is getting the better of you Pap.

[Salvatore Matrecano]

Team Edu’s Fault need to realise that there is more wrong than poor players and the efforts made and tactics employed by the team last night were unacceptable.

Likewise Team Dyche’s Fault need to accept that none of the £200m worth of players who have arrived in the summer have improved our team. Some try hard, some may yet come good but they were brought in to make us challengers this season. Some are clearly very poor and badly thought out choices.

To be honest I don’t want either Edu or Dyche at Nottingham Forest next season.