(03-02-2019, 02:03 AM)Supa Billy Davies Wrote: (03-02-2019, 01:37 AM)NG3 Wrote: (02-02-2019, 10:05 PM)wassy04 Wrote: The irony of preaching for time for the owners...
The irony is not lost on me, I've been calling for managers to be given more time for years, but it's all intertwined, how can we as fans call for the precious commodity of time, if we're not willing to give it ourselves?
How many fans called for the head of Billy, or Psycho, or Warburton, or some other manager they perhaps didn't like & then complained when others called for the head of one they did like?
Or how many threw their toys out the pram over Karanka, demanding he should have been given longer, before immediately trying to undermine O'Neill, or the new owners?
How can we seriously call for time, if we're not willing to give it ourselves?
Agree with this.
I'm really not happy with some of the footballing decisions which EM & co have made. In fact I too feel outright insulted by their promises of time + stability, then pulling the plug halfway through 2 years on the spin.
But if we do the same then we're just as low & weak as they are. I think they need to know fans aren't happy, and also know what we're not happy about. But they should also know that we'll give them time to address those issues, and they follow suit and do the same for folk who have done well here.
The thing is. You pull the plug half way through two years in a row? You're just not going to get promoted.
You basically have a pre-season again, on top of the 'bad run of form' (which all teams have...See Bristol City, Birmingham, even Norwich started off the season poorly...) which add up to torpedoing the season.
Under the current leadership. Brian Clough would have been sacked. Either because he'd have taken longer than required to get the results wanted, he was too brash or couldn't work with the 'structure' within the club.
Could anybody imagine somebody from 'up above' going and sitting on Brian Clough's bench? Telling him who he could or couldn't sign? A chairmen telling him that he knew better than Brian? Telling him to get the job to point 'a' for a 'half season' score card of eg. 'Top 6?'
The thing with Aitor was. I got the vibe somebody had stuck their nose in. He flipped out. He wanted some targets...and because he was 'one place' outside the top 6 he wasn't getting anymore. Something triggered him. It did at Boro'. But they knew they were getting a 'two and a half' season job manager when they hired him. Giving him the 'learning walk' treatment or scoring him a '1' (I'm being metaphorical...or some such...) just because 'Forest' were in transition (and that's what this season is, folks, like it or not...) was asking for it. A proud Spaniard just wasn't going to take that.
They knew they were getting a 'build for the future' manager in Warburton. Probably a three season job in total.
They've hired MoN & Keane who have a glittering set of CVs. But it's a two by four. It's a hammer to crack a nut. They'll still need that important commodity.
My experience of 'upper management?' They want 'you.' Except, they don't want 'you.' They want 'them' doing 'you.' The Problem with that..? Men of conviction, strong personalities who WILL get the job done IN TIME? (Three years for Mr. Clough, folks...)
Will explode. (See Billy MkII.) Will flip out and quit. (See Aitor.) Or fall on their sword. See Warburton.
Or 'quit.' (See Clough and the proverb of Derby. His 'Boss' may have had 2 European cups if he'd just left Brian alone.)
Part of their brilliance and allure? They're their own men. Men of conviction. But they need to be left alone to a degree. Get too many chiefs sticking their nose in...and you go from being a 'well run' club off the field to being naive and interfering. And that has consequences. Then you get the fall outs.
Ie. If you want a 'yes' man. Appoint one. We know the types. The ones that are bland and you don't care so much any more. (We've had a few managers like that, too.)
With Aitor. I felt we had a chance this season. We had a style of play. We needed 2-3 additions. And even if we fell short? We could then add another pre-season (back to back pre-seasons? Now, there's a thought...when was the last year we had back to back pre-seasons with the same manager in charge?) to build further into a top 6 club with a chance of Autos.
It seems it just wasn't too be.
And know we have a genuine club legend in charge. With all the CV any Forest fan could wish for. But without time and backing to see it through? To hold your nerve through a 'bad December?' Might as well forget it.
It will be just 'Ground Hog' dog. And that's why some fans are p*ssed off. Regardless of how Aitor did. Maybe they just wanted to see him finish the goddamn season off. To see some built. And build further. To see a couple of seasons through. Er...'progression.'
How do you know if something will work or not if you don't give it time? It just doesn't make sense.
There's nothing wrong with Warbs, Aitor or MoN. Pick one. Stick with it.
Regardless of 'who' said 'what' to 'who...', I can understand why some are doing their nut.
SA.
