The Infrastructure Projects

[Salvatore Matrecano]

To answer that I believe Everton took out loans that counted as PSR losses and then tried to make out they were used in interest repayments on the stadium which wouldn’t have counted against PSR. It was the initial intended use of the loan that was in dispute.
So yes we can do an infrastructure project that doesn’t count for PSR purposes and presumably won’t under new rules either.

[Username]

Does Marinakis actually have the money to build a half a billion pound stadium and a training ground at probably £100m while servicing a premier league club that costs him £40m a year, a greek club and now a Portuguese club? I know he's a wealthy man but that's an awful lot of money.

The stadium build would be mortgaged over a lot of years

Interesting. 

Surely the costs of servicing a loan of that magnitude would outweigh the financial benefit in the short and medium term?

Toton for example would be funded partly by a Grant you would think.

15 extra seats at £30 a game equates to an additional 10m a year in revenue
Then a brand new ground would absolutely dwarf our current commercial revenue not just on match days, but 365 days of the year.
We make about 2/3m a year from match day corporate hospitality.
That would double or treble with a purpose built stadium.
Then you have stadium naming rights that would be lucrative.

A new stadium would easily generate 20/25m more a year in revenue 

Infrastructure costs aren’t counted in PSR regs, so this is / would be game changing

I very much doubt it will be funded by a grant, in fact I’d happily wager that it won’t, that’s just a case of people putting two and two together. 

Therefore I suspect that the level of debt funding won’t be dissimilar to what will come in from a turnover perspective, especially if they are going to build a whole sports village.

[Username]

In which case, genuine question, why have Everton in part been penalised for PSR breaches due to losses associated with their new stadium?


Also think you are exaggerating the £20-25m extra revenue and ignoring that developing the CG would generate a substantial extra amount. I do though accept long term a new stadium gives more income. I question how much extra that is and if that value is worth selling our soul for?

Sorry, hadn’t seen your post but I suspect you are largely correct.

[Uwantlee]

Selling our soul is a bit dramatic isn't it ... I mean clubs move on... Man city did, arsenal did, Leicester did and they have all had success. As long as it's done right. The soul of this club is and always will be the fans. The city ground is a special place but are we willing to let past success dictate the future? If... And only if, we would bring in more revenue from a new ground than we ever could where we are then it should be done.. no brainer for me .. we will always have the European cups, league championship, memories of the city ground but that's the past. We haven't been successful for 30 years. I'd love to see a competitive forest again in my life time. God forbid we win a trophy again.

[McDurban]

In which case, genuine question, why have Everton in part been penalised for PSR breaches due to losses associated with their new stadium?


Also think you are exaggerating the £20-25m extra revenue and ignoring that developing the CG would generate a substantial extra amount. I do though accept long term a new stadium gives more income. I question how much extra that is and if that value is worth selling our soul for?

It was not financed through long term debt, is what I heard.

[Sniffer Dog (Admin)]

Selling our soul is a bit dramatic isn't it ... I mean clubs move on... Man city did, arsenal did, Leicester did and they have all had success. As long as it's done right. The soul of this club is and always will be the fans. The city ground is a special place but are we willing to let past success dictate the future? If... And only if, we would bring in more revenue from a new ground than we ever could where we are then it should be done.. no brainer for me .. we will always have the European cups, league championship, memories of the city ground but that's the past. We haven't been successful for 30 years. I'd love to see a competitive forest again in my life time. God forbid we win a trophy again.

The thing is the teams you mentioned and their stadiums didn't have the same connections with their fans like the City Ground does with our fans. For me it is not just about money and producing more income there is a bigger picture to see. Plus producing more income is not all of a sudden going to elevate us into a top six club. 

Man City, Arsenal, Leicester (the clubs you mentioned) their fans didn't experience that walk over Trent Bridge like we do, they didn't experience the pubs, the cafes, the restaurants before a game in Bridgford like we do. They didn't experience great European nights and winning European Cup semi finals in their stadiums like we did.

We are selling our soul and we are selling it for a few bucks which guarantees absolutely nothing.

[ToryTom]

Selling our soul is a bit dramatic isn't it ... I mean clubs move on... Man city did, arsenal did, Leicester did and they have all had success. As long as it's done right. The soul of this club is and always will be the fans. The city ground is a special place but are we willing to let past success dictate the future? If... And only if, we would bring in more revenue from a new ground than we ever could where we are then it should be done.. no brainer for me .. we will always have the European cups, league championship, memories of the city ground but that's the past. We haven't been successful for 30 years. I'd love to see a competitive forest again in my life time. God forbid we win a trophy again.

The thing is the teams you mentioned and their stadiums didn't have the same connections with their fans like the City Ground does with our fans. For me it is not just about money and producing more income there is a bigger picture to see. Plus producing more income is not all of a sudden going to elevate us into a top six club. 

Man City, Arsenal, Leicester (the clubs you mentioned) their fans didn't experience that walk over Trent Bridge like we do, they didn't experience the pubs, the cafes, the restaurants before a game in Bridgford like we do. They didn't experience great European nights and winning European Cup semi finals in their stadiums like we did.

We are selling our soul and we are selling it for a few bucks which guarantees absolutely nothing.

Maine Road was iconic for Man City fans, same with Upton park or the Boleyn ground for Wham, Goodison Park for Everton fans. The fans of these clubs revered those grounds as least as much as we do the City Ground but I bet if you asked fans of those clubs if they regretted the moves away from them I bet they wouldn’t. Everton haven’t gone yet but I know a couple of their fans who can’t wait to get into the new stadium.

[Sniffer Dog (Admin)]

I am not sure why we are comparing other clubs.

I am sticking to my guns that none of them had a connection to their stadiums like we do.

Also ask visiting fans in the PL what there favourite away day is and you will be amazed how many say Forest and you hear the words 'proper stadium, proper city and proper fans' mentioned. I guarantee that won't be the case if we move.

And all for what? A few bucks more.

I would rather compete in the bottom six of the PL at the CG then compete between 7th and 12th in a new stadium because that will probably be the reality.

[wassy04]

In which case, genuine question, why have Everton in part been penalised for PSR breaches due to losses associated with their new stadium?


Also think you are exaggerating the £20-25m extra revenue and ignoring that developing the CG would generate a substantial extra amount. I do though accept long term a new stadium gives more income. I question how much extra that is and if that value is worth selling our soul for?

It was not financed through long term debt, is what I heard.

I believe the Everton issue is the original use for the loan was for the stadium, however it has since been used to cover operating losses.

[Trailer Park Tom]

I am not sure why we are comparing other clubs.

I am sticking to my guns that mone of them had a connection to their stadiums like we do.

Also ask visiting fans in the PL what there favourite away day is and you will be amazed how many say Forest and you hear the words 'proper stadium, proper city and proper fans' mentioned. I guarantee that won't be the case if we move.

And all for what? A few bucks more.

I would rather compete in the bottom six of the PL at the CG then compete between 7th and 12th in a new stadium because that will probably be the reality.

Agreed.

People are being sold snake oil. This is more about politics than football. 

Palace have finished between 10th and 13th since 2013 with a single 14th and 15th as their lowest. Lots of other examples such as Wolves, Fulham, Bournemouth and Brentford.

This is dodgy and unnecessary.

[Redreg]

I am not sure why we are comparing other clubs.

I am sticking to my guns that mone of them had a connection to their stadiums like we do.

Also ask visiting fans in the PL what there favourite away day is and you will be amazed how many say Forest and you hear the words 'proper stadium, proper city and proper fans' mentioned. I guarantee that won't be the case if we move.

And all for what? A few bucks more.

I would rather compete in the bottom six of the PL at the CG then compete between 7th and 12th in a new stadium because that will probably be the reality.

Agreed.

People are being sold snake oil. This is more about politics than football. 

Palace have finished between 10th and 13th since 2013 with a 14th and 15th as their lowest. Lots of other examples such as Wolves, Fulham, Bournemouth and Brentford.

This is dodgy and unnecessary.

100% agree the extra 10,000 seats in season tickets would give us an extra 5 Million a year in revenue which is peanuts and I don’t buy into the extra commercial revenue crap a new Peter Taylor stand would achieve the same goal !! 
Just sell the naming rights call it the Fedex City Ground for all i Care it will still be the city ground. 
This would be an absolute disaster for the City and the Club .

[wassy04]

Spurs increase matchday revenue alone from 40m to 106m when they moved into their new stadium so if its done right it can clearly greatly increase revenue.

As for the political thing, one person's covering for Tory f**k up is another's bargain. This land has become available, the govt is keen to sell quickly, to me that sounds like EM trying to take advantage of a good opportunity to get a bargain.

I'm not saying I necessarily support it, I thinking moving is probably the best option but only if the right location and done right. I guess we're unlikely to know whether they were right until after it's done!