Our Track Record In The Loan Market

[Alf]

That's a fair exception Jean, but even then I think you have to limit the amount of players you do that with.

A club looking to get promoted asap (which we clearly have been since EM sacked Warbs and chucked 25m at 1 window) should be signing promotion ready-now players, with maybe the odd gamble.

Our problem is our overall strategy is gamble heavy, and it doesn't reflect the intent set by the owners. I look at all the signings we've made since EM arrive and ask myself "which of those players would other top 6 clubs sign?"

LOANS

Colback - Yes

Dowell - Maybe
Figueredo - Maybe
Tomlin - Maybe

Muric - No
Semedo - No
Bostock - No
Mir - No
Dias - No
Goncalves - No
Byram - No
Janko - No
Bonatini - No
Pele - No
Wague - No
Ferderici - No
Pantillimon - No


PERMINANT

Lewis Grabban - Definite Yes
Michael Dawson - Yes
Joe Lolley - Yes
Samba - Yes

Yuri Ribeiro - Possible Yes
Tiago Silva - Possible Yes
Samba Sow - Possible Yes (Big injury history)
Ben Watson - Possible Yes

Tobias Figueiredo - Maybe
Claudio Yacob - Maybe
Alexander Milošević - Maybe

Albert Adomah - No
Sammy Ameobi - No
Carl Jenkinson - No
João Carvalho - No
Luke Steele - No
Hillal Soudani - No
Michael Hefele - No
Jack Robinson - No
Costel Pantilimon - No
Karim Ansarifard - No
Panagiotis Tachtsidis - No
Yohan Benalouane - No
Jason Cummings - No
Barrie McKay - No
Andreas Bouchalakis - No
Liam Bridcutt - No
Daryl Murphy - No
Tendayi Darikwa - No

That too me is poor, and I think I'm being kind with some of the Yes' & Maybe's too.

The only players which I think would be certs to be targeted by other clubs with genuine promotion aspirations are Samba, Grabs, Daws, Colback and Lolley. That's 5 players. So let's say the "possible yes" & "maybe" columns get 50% of their quota - 13, again being kind round up to 7.

So that'd give us 12 players from 46.

26%

All I can say is thank God for the academy. Hell even one of the definite "yes" ones is an academy product. No side aiming for promotion is gonna obtain it with under 1/3rd of their signings fit for purpose. I don't expect it to be perfect, but would expect that number to be in the 50-60% region.

We shouldn't have to loan as many to check them out, we should have better scouts who know this league. Several players I picked out pre-season were Grosicki, Olivera, Luongo - around 8m worth of signings in key areas we need cover. No idea why such bargains go under the radar, whilst we fork out 18m on the likes of Carvalho, Soudani & Jenks, not to mention all the wages on the loans etc.

Recruitment at the club has been pretty awful all round for years, and this year we're largely being propped up by the academy & a manager with a tried & tested, solid Championship method.

If the club wants to be a Prem club, it has to start making Prem decisions & actions. Not throwing so much hit & hope in the air.

[zicorice]

Just catching up on this thread, really interesting and agree mostly.

Robbie Blake though? We were used to get a fat unfit player up to speed for his parent club who were able to then sell him. He was rubbish until his last 2 or 3 games, where he scored 1 (against Burnley?). He played 11 games, scored 1 and tore apart Preston I think it was. Then went back to Bradford and was signed by Burnley....where he was decent!! 

So a rubbish loan again for us, a bit like Matthew Upson.

[Alf]

Just catching up on this thread, really interesting and agree mostly.

Robbie Blake though? We were used to get a fat unfit player up to speed for his parent club who were able to then sell him. He was rubbish until his last 2 or 3 games, where he scored 1 (against Burnley?). He played 11 games, scored 1 and tore apart Preston I think it was. Then went back to Bradford and was signed by Burnley....where he was decent!! 

So a rubbish loan again for us, a bit like Matthew Upson.

That's the perfect example of how daft we've been. We do the legwork & let others profit.

Blake was a quality player, just needed fitness. We got him that, had the opportunity to sign him for 250k, and decided it was too rich for our tastes. Class Forest self-harming.

Muric & Mir are examples of how not to do a loan - players who needs ages to get up to speed for the job in hand, and who'll offer little more than other players in their position when they do.

Blake was an example of how to do a loan - quality player, lacking fitness, get fit then buy at a budget price, and you've a quality player for next to nowt.

[the jock]

We get silva and carvalho

West brom get Pereira from sporting Lisbon on loan. 10 assists and 5 goals in 20 apps. Big gulf there.

[Maltared]

Alf to reply to your post of who we have that might be useful to other promotion chasing teams, I see Samba as the only player that can make the difference. Dawson is getting to the last games of his career ( who is going to spend money on him?), Lolley is playing as an average player, nd his value is dropping game after game ( what a mistake it was if we really were offered 15 million in the summer for him nd not accepted, now we will be lucky to get 4), Colback plays for Newcastle nx Grabban is the type of player that a promotion chasing team will only get him on loan for the last 6 months (Aston Villa), a risk to offer him a long and expensive contract nd then have him as a burden on the wage bill ( not good for the premiership).
The only other prospects are two of our own, Worrall nx Cash but I doubt that we will get more then 15 million combined.

[Strawberry Avenger]

We get silva and carvalho

West brom get Pereira from sporting Lisbon on loan. 10 assists and 5 goals in 20 apps. Big gulf there.

Recruitment counts.

Forest haven't been pulling up enough trees in this dept.

SA.