Current Players Thread

[Salvatore Matrecano]

I probably back Williams more than anyone else on here, think he has potential to be a great wing back. But in the back 4 we have used most of this season Aurier has been by far the superior defender.
Not really sure what you mean about Awoniyi either. Service to all our forwards has been poor the majority of the season if we are honest. There are a fair few things that Cooper could have done better but with respect I don’t really agree with those you have mentioned.

[JoeWorrallsBrain]

Not sure if this is the right thread, but an interesting article on how Cooper changed the formation/tactics through the season.

He sure did, but it never seemed that he was building towards his optimal lineup and formation.  It always seemed either like random experiments from week to week or knee jerk reactions to injuries or errors made by players in the preceeding game.  How long did it take him to figure out that Williams was better than Aurier at right back (he did, eventually, but then Williams was injured within 2 games of the switch).  Or that MGW was more effective attacking from a midfield position (and shooting from outside the box, rather than carrying into the box)?  Or that MGW was the most reliable penalty shooter on the team?  Or that Awoniyi was his best threat in the air to occupy the centre of opposing boxes?   The answer is - almost the entire season, but it isn't really clear that he's committed to those conclusions, even now.

I don't think fans can be satisfied that his lay deep, 18% possession and hoof it up the pitch to Awoniyi tactic is the successful formula for progressing up the table next year (or even for staying up by the end of that season).  Rather, I think that by employing such desperate tactics, and having Lady Luck bail him out, we are back to square one tactically for the start of next season.

To me, Cooper seems lost at this level.  It will be hard, nevertheless to move on from him, because the fans are so grateful for the promotiion run, and he seems very well liked by the fans and his players.

Sorry but can't just let this sit uncontested. So much is wrong or misinformed here. Aren't you the guy that wanted us to play Kouyate at right wing anyway?

Since when was Williams better than Aurier? Aurier is quite clearly a better right back, Williams only came back due to injury and then the change in formation. 

MGW's penalty record is not great either not sure if you watched the penalty shootout last year vs Sheff U or the one vs Wolves this year where his pen should've been saved. Brennan was fine last year at penalties and hit a good one vs Bournemouth too. Of course Awoniyi was the best player in the air, you know he was injured for half the season right?

This season Williams was consistently better than Aurier.   Aurier's defensive coverage was poor, his ball distribution was poor and he had far too much interest in running forward into attacking positions despite his inability to track back into defense at any pace.  Aurier may have been a better player than Williams at some time in the past, but not during this season.  Williams played responsibly at RB while still contributing valuable passing from the wing (as he did in the game in which he was injured).

My comment on MGW is not that he is the best penalty taker in the league, it's that he's the best penalty taker on this  team.  Part of that is that he is the most reliable shooter on the team to keep the ball below the bar.  I think BJ is our best player, but I don't trust him at the penalty spot, because his shooting is less reliable.  BJ is a much better player from open play.

Yes, Awoniyi was not available much of the season.  But that doesn't explain why, once available, it took Cooper so long to structure his offence to play balls in the air to him, and to have him attack in the middle.  He is a better aerial threat than BJ, or anyone else on the team.

I like Williams and think he showed enough before injury that he could do a good job for us in the future-though I do worry a bit about his lack of real pace. But Aurier has been one of our best players this season. Either you are on a wind up, insane or haven't watched any games. All of which invalidates the rest of what you said.

You sound like an enthusiastic fan.  You may still have the game recordings available to you (as I do).  Rewatch some games.  Watch Aurier get caught up field consistently, and:  a) take fouls tackling from behind, and/or b) arrive back in defence but wrong sided to his mark.  Consistently.  He also fancied himself a crosser of the ball (thus, moving himself into those wide positions upfield), but the vast majority of his cross attempts were blocked or well off the mark (followed of course, by him trailing the inevitable counter back into his own half).  I wanted him to be good.  He's been good in the past, but he's lost something (pace, I think).

[Paplane]

He sure did, but it never seemed that he was building towards his optimal lineup and formation.  It always seemed either like random experiments from week to week or knee jerk reactions to injuries or errors made by players in the preceeding game.  How long did it take him to figure out that Williams was better than Aurier at right back (he did, eventually, but then Williams was injured within 2 games of the switch).  Or that MGW was more effective attacking from a midfield position (and shooting from outside the box, rather than carrying into the box)?  Or that MGW was the most reliable penalty shooter on the team?  Or that Awoniyi was his best threat in the air to occupy the centre of opposing boxes?   The answer is - almost the entire season, but it isn't really clear that he's committed to those conclusions, even now.

I don't think fans can be satisfied that his lay deep, 18% possession and hoof it up the pitch to Awoniyi tactic is the successful formula for progressing up the table next year (or even for staying up by the end of that season).  Rather, I think that by employing such desperate tactics, and having Lady Luck bail him out, we are back to square one tactically for the start of next season.

To me, Cooper seems lost at this level.  It will be hard, nevertheless to move on from him, because the fans are so grateful for the promotiion run, and he seems very well liked by the fans and his players.

Sorry but can't just let this sit uncontested. So much is wrong or misinformed here. Aren't you the guy that wanted us to play Kouyate at right wing anyway?

Since when was Williams better than Aurier? Aurier is quite clearly a better right back, Williams only came back due to injury and then the change in formation. 

MGW's penalty record is not great either not sure if you watched the penalty shootout last year vs Sheff U or the one vs Wolves this year where his pen should've been saved. Brennan was fine last year at penalties and hit a good one vs Bournemouth too. Of course Awoniyi was the best player in the air, you know he was injured for half the season right?

This season Williams was consistently better than Aurier.   Aurier's defensive coverage was poor, his ball distribution was poor and he had far too much interest in running forward into attacking positions despite his inability to track back into defense at any pace.  Aurier may have been a better player than Williams at some time in the past, but not during this season.  Williams played responsibly at RB while still contributing valuable passing from the wing (as he did in the game in which he was injured).

My comment on MGW is not that he is the best penalty taker in the league, it's that he's the best penalty taker on this  team.  Part of that is that he is the most reliable shooter on the team to keep the ball below the bar.  I think BJ is our best player, but I don't trust him at the penalty spot, because his shooting is less reliable.  BJ is a much better player from open play.

Yes, Awoniyi was not available much of the season.  But that doesn't explain why, once available, it took Cooper so long to structure his offence to play balls in the air to him, and to have him attack in the middle.  He is a better aerial threat than BJ, or anyone else on the team.

I like Williams and think he showed enough before injury that he could do a good job for us in the future-though I do worry a bit about his lack of real pace. But Aurier has been one of our best players this season. Either you are on a wind up, insane or haven't watched any games. All of which invalidates the rest of what you said.

You sound like an enthusiastic fan.  You may still have the game recordings available to you (as I do).  Rewatch some games.  Watch Aurier get caught up field consistently, and:  a) take fouls tackling from behind, and/or b) arrive back in defence but wrong sided to his mark.  Consistently.  He also fancied himself a crosser of the ball (thus, moving himself into those wide positions upfield), but the vast majority of his cross attempts were blocked or well off the mark (followed of course, by him trailing the inevitable counter back into his own half).  I wanted him to be good.  He's been good in the past, but he's lost something (pace, I think).

He was a massive positive influence when he arrived in the first team. Think it was Leicester away when he came on.  Up to that point we were shipping goals left right and centre. If he hadn't struggled with his injuries in the last third of the season he'd be right up there as my poty. Williams has shown glimmers of potential but Aurier's on a differemt level.

[Username]

Yes he had to play a number of games, funnily enough as soon as it was made perm he got injured

Yeh it was after 3 games.

Still can’t believe we made this transfer: it looked  Crazy at the time

Why did it look crazy? Signing a well respected, target man type striker, a position we had a massive need for before Taiwo got injured. 

Easily the best proven striker on the market at that point. The only issue was he doesn't really suit the counter attacking element of the team. Otherwise, thought it was sensible at the time and he'll still be a useful backup to Taiwo next year. On paper he's a clear upgrade on Surridge.

31. Hardly scored in premier league for two seasons. Very poor at Newcastle. Cost £19 million with £100,000 a week wages for three seasons with no relegation clause. Crazy.

He wasn’t very poor at Newcastle, far from it and was largely credited with a big part in keeping them up. Goal’s isn’t the total sum of contribution.

[Jacksbadhobbits]

Yeh it was after 3 games.

Still can’t believe we made this transfer: it looked  Crazy at the time

Why did it look crazy? Signing a well respected, target man type striker, a position we had a massive need for before Taiwo got injured. 

Easily the best proven striker on the market at that point. The only issue was he doesn't really suit the counter attacking element of the team. Otherwise, thought it was sensible at the time and he'll still be a useful backup to Taiwo next year. On paper he's a clear upgrade on Surridge.

31. Hardly scored in premier league for two seasons. Very poor at Newcastle. Cost £19 million with £100,000 a week wages for three seasons with no relegation clause. Crazy.

He wasn’t very poor at Newcastle, far from it and was largely credited with a big part in keeping them up. Goal’s isn’t the total sum of contribution.

Costs a fortune with little resale value because of age. Hardly scored in premier league for last two seasons and clearly not that great at holding the ball up as seen in his Forest performances. Not obvious what his strengths actually are. I bet Newcastle couldn’t believe their luck when we came along. Can’t afford too many more like this especially if don’t have relegation clauses

[Username]

So I was right then?

The point being that he played a pivotal part in helping Newcastle transition from being a bottom third team into a top half team.

It doesn’t happen overnight.

If you hadn’t noticed we stayed up so his resale value and the release clause are irrelevant for another season.

If you can’t see what he’s capable of then that’s more likely a you problem quite frankly. It’s evident that we weren’t playing to his strengths, he needs the ball into feet in and around the box, forget his height.

Wood played no small part in us staying up, his goal against Man City and his assist against Festa, should not be undervalued.

[Jacksbadhobbits]

So I was right then?

The point being that he played a pivotal part in helping Newcastle transition from being a bottom third team into a top half team.

It doesn’t happen overnight.

If you hadn’t noticed we stayed up so his resale value and the release clause are irrelevant for another season.

If you can’t see what he’s capable of then that’s more likely a you problem quite frankly. It’s evident that we weren’t playing to his strengths, he needs the ball into feet in and around the box, forget his height.

Wood played no small part in us staying up, his goal against Man City and his assist against Festa, should not be undervalued.

Is that it for £19 million and £100,000 per week for the next three years. Might we have been able to find a similar small contribution for something a little bit cheaper. Potentially it’s signings like that which take clubs to financial ruin. If we had got relegated how do you justify his output for the cost. It will even have an impact this summer with how much we can spend. Surely on the basis of paying £100,000 per week he is going to take up one of the 25 squad places and if Taiwo gets injured is Wood going to be an adequate replacement. We will need much better but the outlay we are committed to for Wood is going to restrict the striker pool we will be fishing in. Dreadful signing.

[Marinakis Red]

So I was right then?

The point being that he played a pivotal part in helping Newcastle transition from being a bottom third team into a top half team.

It doesn’t happen overnight.

If you hadn’t noticed we stayed up so his resale value and the release clause are irrelevant for another season.

If you can’t see what he’s capable of then that’s more likely a you problem quite frankly. It’s evident that we weren’t playing to his strengths, he needs the ball into feet in and around the box, forget his height.

Wood played no small part in us staying up, his goal against Man City and his assist against Festa, should not be undervalued.

Assist against Festa? They were both MGW to Johnson.

[Username]

So I was right then?

The point being that he played a pivotal part in helping Newcastle transition from being a bottom third team into a top half team.

It doesn’t happen overnight.

If you hadn’t noticed we stayed up so his resale value and the release clause are irrelevant for another season.

If you can’t see what he’s capable of then that’s more likely a you problem quite frankly. It’s evident that we weren’t playing to his strengths, he needs the ball into feet in and around the box, forget his height.

Wood played no small part in us staying up, his goal against Man City and his assist against Festa, should not be undervalued.

Assist against Festa? They were both MGW to Johnson.

Apologies, what was the game where it was played into his feet and he laid it back for MGW?

[Username]

So I was right then?

The point being that he played a pivotal part in helping Newcastle transition from being a bottom third team into a top half team.

It doesn’t happen overnight.

If you hadn’t noticed we stayed up so his resale value and the release clause are irrelevant for another season.

If you can’t see what he’s capable of then that’s more likely a you problem quite frankly. It’s evident that we weren’t playing to his strengths, he needs the ball into feet in and around the box, forget his height.

Wood played no small part in us staying up, his goal against Man City and his assist against Festa, should not be undervalued.

Is that it for £19 million and £100,000 per week for the next three years. Might we have been able to find a similar small contribution for something a little bit cheaper. Potentially it’s signings like that which take clubs to financial ruin. If we had got relegated how do you justify his output for the cost. It will even have an impact this summer with how much we can spend. Surely on the basis of paying £100,000 per week he is going to take up one of the 25 squad places and if Taiwo gets injured is Wood going to be an adequate replacement. We will need much better but the outlay we are committed to for Wood is going to restrict the striker pool we will be fishing in. Dreadful signing.

Might? Quite possibly. 

However we’re dealing with the benefit of hindsight and the fact is that we have stayed up. 

This isn’t some kind of multiverse. We didn’t get relegated. 

How about we deal in facts. 

Do you think we’ll start next season with Wood and Taiwo as our main two striking options? Me neither. Wood will quite possibly be third choice and at this level it will be hard to get someone with his level of ability and attitude to fill that role for anything less than we’ve laid out. 

You come across as wishing we had got relegated to rejoice in the fact that Wood isn’t the signing that you wanted and we’d be lumbered with his contract for its remainder. 

I’m sorry Forest let you down.

You might however get be able to get a job at Talksport with that level of negativity about us / one of ours.

[Reds73]

So I was right then?

The point being that he played a pivotal part in helping Newcastle transition from being a bottom third team into a top half team.

It doesn’t happen overnight.

If you hadn’t noticed we stayed up so his resale value and the release clause are irrelevant for another season.

If you can’t see what he’s capable of then that’s more likely a you problem quite frankly. It’s evident that we weren’t playing to his strengths, he needs the ball into feet in and around the box, forget his height.

Wood played no small part in us staying up, his goal against Man City and his assist against Festa, should not be undervalued.

Is that it for £19 million and £100,000 per week for the next three years. Might we have been able to find a similar small contribution for something a little bit cheaper. Potentially it’s signings like that which take clubs to financial ruin. If we had got relegated how do you justify his output for the cost. It will even have an impact this summer with how much we can spend. Surely on the basis of paying £100,000 per week he is going to take up one of the 25 squad places and if Taiwo gets injured is Wood going to be an adequate replacement. We will need much better but the outlay we are committed to for Wood is going to restrict the striker pool we will be fishing in. Dreadful signing.

Where are you getting the next 3 yrs from ?
Chris Wood signed a permanent contract that runs until Summer 2024.
That was from the OS when he triggered the permanent

[Madforit]

So I was right then?

The point being that he played a pivotal part in helping Newcastle transition from being a bottom third team into a top half team.

It doesn’t happen overnight.

If you hadn’t noticed we stayed up so his resale value and the release clause are irrelevant for another season.

If you can’t see what he’s capable of then that’s more likely a you problem quite frankly. It’s evident that we weren’t playing to his strengths, he needs the ball into feet in and around the box, forget his height.

Wood played no small part in us staying up, his goal against Man City and his assist against Festa, should not be undervalued.

Is that it for £19 million and £100,000 per week for the next three years. Might we have been able to find a similar small contribution for something a little bit cheaper. Potentially it’s signings like that which take clubs to financial ruin. If we had got relegated how do you justify his output for the cost. It will even have an impact this summer with how much we can spend. Surely on the basis of paying £100,000 per week he is going to take up one of the 25 squad places and if Taiwo gets injured is Wood going to be an adequate replacement. We will need much better but the outlay we are committed to for Wood is going to restrict the striker pool we will be fishing in. Dreadful signing.

Might? Quite possibly. 

However we’re dealing with the benefit of hindsight and the fact is that we have stayed up. 

This isn’t some kind of multiverse. We didn’t get relegated. 

How about we deal in facts. 

Do you think we’ll start next season with Wood and Taiwo as our main two striking options? Me neither. Wood will quite possibly be third choice and at this level it will be hard to get someone with his level of ability and attitude to fill that role for anything less than we’ve laid out. 

You come across as wishing we had got relegated to rejoice in the fact that Wood isn’t the signing that you wanted and we’d be lumbered with his contract for its remainder. 

I’m sorry Forest let you down.

You might however get be able to get a job at Talksport with that level of negativity about us / one of ours.

Lol