The Premier League 2022/23

[Paplane]

Big Sam to Leeds? Wow, that looks like an act of desperation. But he's the type of character you'd expect might be able to go in somewhere and make a bit of a difference, short term. But has he still got it?

I suggested him as a joke before, I suppose at least he's likely to offer a different perspective. Not sure it'll be a particularly good one though!

No, but he's a big character and you'd imagine he has the personality to go in and kick a few arses. He couldn't do any worse.

[Madforit]

Big Sam to Leeds? Wow, that looks like an act of desperation. But he's the type of character you'd expect might be able to go in somewhere and make a bit of a difference, short term. But has he still got it?

I suggested him as a joke before, I suppose at least he's likely to offer a different perspective. Not sure it'll be a particularly good one though!

No, but he's a big character and you'd imagine he has the personality to go in and kick a few arses. He couldn't do any worse.

I hope for our sake he turns out to be worse( if he goes there)

[nffc93]

Lee Bowyer the other name in frame for Leeds

[DR Forest]

Sounds like Leeds about to sack Gracia

That's weird because I thought a new manager automatically guaranteed you an improvement?

No it guarantees nothing but more often than not teams see an initial improvement.

Thank God we didn't stick with Hughton last season.

An initial improvement that often then drops up after a few games.

Obviously it can work, particularly if you have an unsuccessful coach at that time or someone really highly regarded is available. 

However, in general it will fail more times than it'll succeed. You don't need me to list how many times it didn't work for us before Cooper.

I fail to see your point.

Changing managers...sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't, it's always a gamble.

But if you are bottom of the league with 6 points from the last 36, the worst away form in the whole football league then perhaps it would have been worth a try? You keep banging on about clubs not improving who have changed manager (which is not entirely true) but you always fail to mention that we haven't improved either and we kept our manager.

I’ve not been on for a while but let’s cut to the chase here- it’s clear you still want cooper replaced.

Don’t tip toe round the handbags when challenged on this- say it as it is.
You are entitled to that view.
Perhaps it’s indicative of the feelings over in Greece…?

All I can say is they better have a top top level guy lined up to replace him.
If so, then there is merit in the debate.
However, there will always be a counter argument to hold your nerve and steady the ship for the medium to long term.

Cooper effectively shot himself in the foot last season By overachieving.
He got us promoted too soon, plain and simple. We lacked a squad core for the championship let alone the premiership.

This season he has made mistakes tactically and on recruitment but given the size of the task and the utterly cruel injury list then I think he’s earned some respect and latitude.

Fingers crossed we stay up and we can then improve his reign by adding-
More joined up recruitment like Brighton or Brentford;
More supportive experience in the dug out; and
A full analysis of training techniques, surfaces, rehab, physio etc to identify reasons for injuries other than  sheer bad luck.

[Shawoddyred]

That's weird because I thought a new manager automatically guaranteed you an improvement?

No it guarantees nothing but more often than not teams see an initial improvement.

Thank God we didn't stick with Hughton last season.

An initial improvement that often then drops up after a few games.

Obviously it can work, particularly if you have an unsuccessful coach at that time or someone really highly regarded is available. 

However, in general it will fail more times than it'll succeed. You don't need me to list how many times it didn't work for us before Cooper.

I fail to see your point.

Changing managers...sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't, it's always a gamble.

But if you are bottom of the league with 6 points from the last 36, the worst away form in the whole football league then perhaps it would have been worth a try? You keep banging on about clubs not improving who have changed manager (which is not entirely true) but you always fail to mention that we haven't improved either and we kept our manager.

I’ve not been on for a while but let’s cut to the chase here- it’s clear you still want cooper replaced.

Don’t tip toe round the handbags when challenged on this- say it as it is.
You are entitled to that view.
Perhaps it’s indicative of the feelings over in Greece…?

All I can say is they better have a top top level guy lined up to replace him.
If so, then there is merit in the debate.
However, there will always be a counter argument to hold your nerve and steady the ship for the medium to long term.

Cooper effectively shot himself in the foot last season By overachieving.
He got us promoted too soon, plain and simple. We lacked a squad core for the championship let alone the premiership.

This season he has made mistakes tactically and on recruitment but given the size of the task and the utterly cruel injury list then I think he’s earned some respect and latitude.

Fingers crossed we stay up and we can then improve his reign by adding-
More joined up recruitment like Brighton or Brentford;
More supportive experience in the dug out; and
A full analysis of training techniques, surfaces, rehab, physio etc to identify reasons for injuries other than  sheer bad luck.

Don't disagree with any of that, but your main points below are things that should have been done before this summer but Coops has a major hand in (I believe). So, what's to suggest he will change his approach?

[Sausage Roll]

Wow. Allardyce to Leeds appears to be happening. Both Javi Gracia and Director of Football Victor Orta getting the boot.

[wassy04]

No it guarantees nothing but more often than not teams see an initial improvement.

Thank God we didn't stick with Hughton last season.

An initial improvement that often then drops up after a few games.

Obviously it can work, particularly if you have an unsuccessful coach at that time or someone really highly regarded is available. 

However, in general it will fail more times than it'll succeed. You don't need me to list how many times it didn't work for us before Cooper.

I fail to see your point.

Changing managers...sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't, it's always a gamble.

But if you are bottom of the league with 6 points from the last 36, the worst away form in the whole football league then perhaps it would have been worth a try? You keep banging on about clubs not improving who have changed manager (which is not entirely true) but you always fail to mention that we haven't improved either and we kept our manager.

I’ve not been on for a while but let’s cut to the chase here- it’s clear you still want cooper replaced.

Don’t tip toe round the handbags when challenged on this- say it as it is.
You are entitled to that view.
Perhaps it’s indicative of the feelings over in Greece…?

All I can say is they better have a top top level guy lined up to replace him.
If so, then there is merit in the debate.
However, there will always be a counter argument to hold your nerve and steady the ship for the medium to long term.

Cooper effectively shot himself in the foot last season By overachieving.
He got us promoted too soon, plain and simple. We lacked a squad core for the championship let alone the premiership.

This season he has made mistakes tactically and on recruitment but given the size of the task and the utterly cruel injury list then I think he’s earned some respect and latitude.

Fingers crossed we stay up and we can then improve his reign by adding-
More joined up recruitment like Brighton or Brentford;
More supportive experience in the dug out; and
A full analysis of training techniques, surfaces, rehab, physio etc to identify reasons for injuries other than  sheer bad luck.

Don't disagree with any of that, but your main points below are things that should have been done before this summer but Coops has a major hand in (I believe). So, what's to suggest he will change his approach?

It's just so frustrating as this debate wouldn't even be happening if we just had some better luck on injuries. Perhaps as little as Yates and Taiwo not getting injured would've been enough. Lets not forget the biggest issue we've had this year. We've looked way better whenever we've managed to get close to a full team out.

[wassy04]

Wow. Allardyce to Leeds appears to be happening. Both Javi Gracia and Director of Football Victor Orta getting the boot.

It's pretty funny, I am nervous that it's so crazy it might just work though! Hopefully not.

If I was in this position this is the kind of choatic move I'd make, someone like Dean Smith is not going to change anything.

[Shawoddyred]

An initial improvement that often then drops up after a few games.

Obviously it can work, particularly if you have an unsuccessful coach at that time or someone really highly regarded is available. 

However, in general it will fail more times than it'll succeed. You don't need me to list how many times it didn't work for us before Cooper.

I fail to see your point.

Changing managers...sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't, it's always a gamble.

But if you are bottom of the league with 6 points from the last 36, the worst away form in the whole football league then perhaps it would have been worth a try? You keep banging on about clubs not improving who have changed manager (which is not entirely true) but you always fail to mention that we haven't improved either and we kept our manager.

I’ve not been on for a while but let’s cut to the chase here- it’s clear you still want cooper replaced.

Don’t tip toe round the handbags when challenged on this- say it as it is.
You are entitled to that view.
Perhaps it’s indicative of the feelings over in Greece…?

All I can say is they better have a top top level guy lined up to replace him.
If so, then there is merit in the debate.
However, there will always be a counter argument to hold your nerve and steady the ship for the medium to long term.

Cooper effectively shot himself in the foot last season By overachieving.
He got us promoted too soon, plain and simple. We lacked a squad core for the championship let alone the premiership.

This season he has made mistakes tactically and on recruitment but given the size of the task and the utterly cruel injury list then I think he’s earned some respect and latitude.

Fingers crossed we stay up and we can then improve his reign by adding-
More joined up recruitment like Brighton or Brentford;
More supportive experience in the dug out; and
A full analysis of training techniques, surfaces, rehab, physio etc to identify reasons for injuries other than  sheer bad luck.

Don't disagree with any of that, but your main points below are things that should have been done before this summer but Coops has a major hand in (I believe). So, what's to suggest he will change his approach?

It's just so frustrating as this debate wouldn't even be happening if we just had some better luck on injuries. Perhaps as little as Yates and Taiwo not getting injured would've been enough. Lets not forget the biggest issue we've had this year. We've looked way better whenever we've managed to get close to a full team out.

Maybe, maybe not. I think they make a difference but at the same time the obsession with playing a super low block with 5 at the back does my head in. I think the tactics have a ceiling and work best when we're playing with serious desperation, which only happens when we're desperate funnily enough and isn't sustainable. To be higher up the league we need to have a lot more of the ball and general game and territory control. That doesn't need to happen regardless of injuries.

[Username]

I fail to see your point.

Changing managers...sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't, it's always a gamble.

But if you are bottom of the league with 6 points from the last 36, the worst away form in the whole football league then perhaps it would have been worth a try? You keep banging on about clubs not improving who have changed manager (which is not entirely true) but you always fail to mention that we haven't improved either and we kept our manager.

I’ve not been on for a while but let’s cut to the chase here- it’s clear you still want cooper replaced.

Don’t tip toe round the handbags when challenged on this- say it as it is.
You are entitled to that view.
Perhaps it’s indicative of the feelings over in Greece…?

All I can say is they better have a top top level guy lined up to replace him.
If so, then there is merit in the debate.
However, there will always be a counter argument to hold your nerve and steady the ship for the medium to long term.

Cooper effectively shot himself in the foot last season By overachieving.
He got us promoted too soon, plain and simple. We lacked a squad core for the championship let alone the premiership.

This season he has made mistakes tactically and on recruitment but given the size of the task and the utterly cruel injury list then I think he’s earned some respect and latitude.

Fingers crossed we stay up and we can then improve his reign by adding-
More joined up recruitment like Brighton or Brentford;
More supportive experience in the dug out; and
A full analysis of training techniques, surfaces, rehab, physio etc to identify reasons for injuries other than  sheer bad luck.

Don't disagree with any of that, but your main points below are things that should have been done before this summer but Coops has a major hand in (I believe). So, what's to suggest he will change his approach?

It's just so frustrating as this debate wouldn't even be happening if we just had some better luck on injuries. Perhaps as little as Yates and Taiwo not getting injured would've been enough. Lets not forget the biggest issue we've had this year. We've looked way better whenever we've managed to get close to a full team out.

Maybe, maybe not. I think they make a difference but at the same time the obsession with playing a super low block with 5 at the back does my head in. I think the tactics have a ceiling and work best when we're playing with serious desperation, which only happens when we're desperate funnily enough and isn't sustainable. To be higher up the league we need to have a lot more of the ball and general game and territory control. That doesn't need to happen regardless of injuries.

But you are ignoring the fact that the playing squad has a ceiling too?

[wassy04]

I’ve not been on for a while but let’s cut to the chase here- it’s clear you still want cooper replaced.

Don’t tip toe round the handbags when challenged on this- say it as it is.
You are entitled to that view.
Perhaps it’s indicative of the feelings over in Greece…?

All I can say is they better have a top top level guy lined up to replace him.
If so, then there is merit in the debate.
However, there will always be a counter argument to hold your nerve and steady the ship for the medium to long term.

Cooper effectively shot himself in the foot last season By overachieving.
He got us promoted too soon, plain and simple. We lacked a squad core for the championship let alone the premiership.

This season he has made mistakes tactically and on recruitment but given the size of the task and the utterly cruel injury list then I think he’s earned some respect and latitude.

Fingers crossed we stay up and we can then improve his reign by adding-
More joined up recruitment like Brighton or Brentford;
More supportive experience in the dug out; and
A full analysis of training techniques, surfaces, rehab, physio etc to identify reasons for injuries other than  sheer bad luck.

Don't disagree with any of that, but your main points below are things that should have been done before this summer but Coops has a major hand in (I believe). So, what's to suggest he will change his approach?

It's just so frustrating as this debate wouldn't even be happening if we just had some better luck on injuries. Perhaps as little as Yates and Taiwo not getting injured would've been enough. Lets not forget the biggest issue we've had this year. We've looked way better whenever we've managed to get close to a full team out.

Maybe, maybe not. I think they make a difference but at the same time the obsession with playing a super low block with 5 at the back does my head in. I think the tactics have a ceiling and work best when we're playing with serious desperation, which only happens when we're desperate funnily enough and isn't sustainable. To be higher up the league we need to have a lot more of the ball and general game and territory control. That doesn't need to happen regardless of injuries.

But you are ignoring the fact that the playing squad has a ceiling too?

Yeah you make it sound like if we just changed tactics we'd be midtable, the team and in particular the avialable team due to injury was not able to do this.

Hopefully if we do stay up we can transition to a more sustainable style as the younger players improve, which they've been doing lately like Danilo.

[nffc93]

Big Sam confirmed. Interested to see how this pans out