Hughton's Got A Job On His Hands

[Strawberry Avenger]

You cant say that when chris came in the target was to avoid relegation, especially with our owners

Regardless if your chris in or chris out we all know whats coming in the summer

We can blame players and we should, but at the end of the day its down to the manager to get the best out of players, managers have come in less time to over teams, with worse players than ours, barnsley been one, we were all buzzing when we signed all these players in the summer, saying we had a top 6 squad, they look like they have not even been taught the basics, anyways, we can all argue about pros and cons with each other, iv even seen posters fall out, but at the end of the day, with performances, and results, tactics etc etc blah blah blah,

With Vrentzos at the wheel, and the owner wanting success asap, its looking grim for chris

No it's not. In stark contrast to many other football club owners I believe that EM does actually know a bit about football and knows when things are going down the pan with managers and players.

Exactly.

EM even kept Sabri on for the start of this season, when ideally, theoretically and logically, he should've been sacked at the end of last season. He gave Sabri a chance to redeem the bottle job of last season because he felt there was something that could've been salvaged from the capitulation, but sadly, there was nothing left.

:cool:

A fair eulogy.

SA.

[Paplane]

You cant say that when chris came in the target was to avoid relegation, especially with our owners

Regardless if your chris in or chris out we all know whats coming in the summer

We can blame players and we should, but at the end of the day its down to the manager to get the best out of players, managers have come in less time to over teams, with worse players than ours, barnsley been one, we were all buzzing when we signed all these players in the summer, saying we had a top 6 squad, they look like they have not even been taught the basics, anyways, we can all argue about pros and cons with each other, iv even seen posters fall out, but at the end of the day, with performances, and results, tactics etc etc blah blah blah,

With Vrentzos at the wheel, and the owner wanting success asap, its looking grim for chris

No it's not. In stark contrast to many other football club owners I believe that EM does actually know a bit about football and knows when things are going down the pan with managers and players.

Exactly.

EM even kept Sabri on for the start of this season, when ideally, theoretically and logically, he should've been sacked at the end of last season. He gave Sabri a chance to redeem the bottle job of last season because he felt there was something that could've been salvaged from the capitulation, but sadly, there was nothing left.

And he took on board the comments of Sabri who it seems was advising the change of strategy towards the acquisition of domestic signings rather than foreign based players. Despite the capitulation EM did everything he could to support Sabri and I was all in favour of everything that happened last summer. Sabri was only sacked 5 or 6 games into the season when it was entirely evident that there was a major problem.

When people criticise EM and Hughton I just look down the road at the team managed by a rookie 'name' manager with no experience in his life of fighting relegation, and their new mysterious owner who appears to have no money and no history of wealth.

[wassy04]

You cant say that when chris came in the target was to avoid relegation, especially with our owners

Regardless if your chris in or chris out we all know whats coming in the summer

We can blame players and we should, but at the end of the day its down to the manager to get the best out of players, managers have come in less time to over teams, with worse players than ours, barnsley been one, we were all buzzing when we signed all these players in the summer, saying we had a top 6 squad, they look like they have not even been taught the basics, anyways, we can all argue about pros and cons with each other, iv even seen posters fall out, but at the end of the day, with performances, and results, tactics etc etc blah blah blah,

With Vrentzos at the wheel, and the owner wanting success asap, its looking grim for chris

No it's not. In stark contrast to many other football club owners I believe that EM does actually know a bit about football and knows when things are going down the pan with managers and players.

Exactly.

EM even kept Sabri on for the start of this season, when ideally, theoretically and logically, he should've been sacked at the end of last season. He gave Sabri a chance to redeem the bottle job of last season because he felt there was something that could've been salvaged from the capitulation, but sadly, there was nothing left.

And he took on board the comments of Sabri who it seems was advising the change of strategy towards the acquisition of domestic signings rather than foreign based players. Despite the capitulation EM did everything he could to support Sabri and I was all in favour of everything that happened last summer. Sabri was only sacked 5 or 6 games into the season when it was entirely evident that there was a major problem.

When people criticise EM and Hughton I just look down the road at the team managed by a rookie 'name' manager with no experience in his life of fighting relegation, and their new mysterious owner who appears to have no money and no history of wealth.

I just think a manager won't ever get backed by everyone unless they're having an amazing season. Even if we were top of the league next season, the same few would be out for Hughton after a few defeats. Would be saying things like "well if he can do it anyone can" etc.

Did the ESL stuff not teach us anything, that maybe short term thinking it's very clever and that a long term plan is a good idea. Part of the reason clubs overspend is constant demand from fans for signings and repeated turnover in manager. 

Based on polls we ran last season, there was nearly unanimous agreement by the end to sack Sabri, yet to we really think we'd have finished worse off? Probably about the same I'd imagine. The manager has less impact than some make out, it's the players that matter and this group of players has repeatedly failed under loads of different managers. 

Why not be the team that backs the manager regardless, supports the team in the stands and actually add value as fans. As opposed to game one next season, booing when we go behind despite being away from the games for a year. I get people pay a lot and have a right to an opinion, fine. However, actually exercising that right, however cathartic, is clearly not going to help. People say Marinakis is trigger happy, however part of that is because that's what the fans want. If there was no booing regardless he'd ride through the bad patches and we'd have more chance of longer term success. Look at Bristol City for example, held their nerve for years with Lee Johnson, finally sacked him and dive-bombed. 

If you are one of those people that constantly turns on the manager, please can you answer me how booing the team will help the team win? How criticising the team on here or social media will help the team win? How repeatedly asking for a change of manager will help when it hasn't helped so far? What's the only strategy we haven't tried, not sacking them!

I don't think this is close yet, however figured I'd get this in early.

[Strawberry Avenger]

You cant say that when chris came in the target was to avoid relegation, especially with our owners

Regardless if your chris in or chris out we all know whats coming in the summer

We can blame players and we should, but at the end of the day its down to the manager to get the best out of players, managers have come in less time to over teams, with worse players than ours, barnsley been one, we were all buzzing when we signed all these players in the summer, saying we had a top 6 squad, they look like they have not even been taught the basics, anyways, we can all argue about pros and cons with each other, iv even seen posters fall out, but at the end of the day, with performances, and results, tactics etc etc blah blah blah,

With Vrentzos at the wheel, and the owner wanting success asap, its looking grim for chris

No it's not. In stark contrast to many other football club owners I believe that EM does actually know a bit about football and knows when things are going down the pan with managers and players.

Exactly.

EM even kept Sabri on for the start of this season, when ideally, theoretically and logically, he should've been sacked at the end of last season. He gave Sabri a chance to redeem the bottle job of last season because he felt there was something that could've been salvaged from the capitulation, but sadly, there was nothing left.

And he took on board the comments of Sabri who it seems was advising the change of strategy towards the acquisition of domestic signings rather than foreign based players. Despite the capitulation EM did everything he could to support Sabri and I was all in favour of everything that happened last summer. Sabri was only sacked 5 or 6 games into the season when it was entirely evident that there was a major problem.

When people criticise EM and Hughton I just look down the road at the team managed by a rookie 'name' manager with no experience in his life of fighting relegation, and their new mysterious owner who appears to have no money and no history of wealth.

I just think a manager won't ever get backed by everyone unless they're having an amazing season. Even if we were top of the league next season, the same few would be out for Hughton after a few defeats. Would be saying things like "well if he can do it anyone can" etc.

Did the ESL stuff not teach us anything, that maybe short term thinking it's (isn't) very clever and that a long term plan is a good idea. Part of the reason clubs overspend is constant demand from fans for signings and repeated turnover in manager. 

Based on polls we ran last season, there was nearly unanimous agreement by the end to sack Sabri, yet to we really think we'd have finished worse off? Probably about the same I'd imagine. The manager has less impact than some make out, it's the players that matter and this group of players has repeatedly failed under loads of different managers. 

Why not be the team that backs the manager regardless, supports the team in the stands and actually add value as fans. As opposed to game one next season, booing when we go behind despite being away from the games for a year. I get people pay a lot and have a right to an opinion, fine. However, actually exercising that right, however cathartic, is clearly not going to help. People say Marinakis is trigger happy, however part of that is because that's what the fans want. If there was no booing regardless he'd ride through the bad patches and we'd have more chance of longer term success. Look at Bristol City for example, held their nerve for years with Lee Johnson, finally sacked him and dive-bombed. 

If you are one of those people that constantly turns on the manager, please can you answer me how booing the team will help the team win? How criticising the team on here or social media will help the team win? How repeatedly asking for a change of manager will help when it hasn't helped so far? What's the only strategy we haven't tried, not sacking them!

I don't think this is close yet, however figured I'd get this in early.

The tempered steel of rational thinking, Wassy.  *approves.

Forest need cool, collected and calm surgery starting this Summer. I suspect planning for next season for an overhaul of this patchwork journey men of pretenders has begun in earnest.

Hughton is the the outstanding candidate for that.

SA.

[Salvatore Matrecano]

.
People say Marinakis is trigger happy, however part of that is because that's what the fans want.

Im going to slightly unfairly single out this sentence. I would say EM is trigger happy in that he has a very short fuse if things arent going the right way. Warburton, Karanka and O’Neill were all sacked or their positions made untenable well before most fans were calling for change. So I would say its pretty irrelevant if the fans want a different manager because EM will demand change sooner.

Before Sniffer jumps on me in EMs defence when he gets the right man he will stick with them, Pedro Martins has been at Oly for 3 years now.

[wassy04]

.
People say Marinakis is trigger happy, however part of that is because that's what the fans want.

Im going to slightly unfairly single out this sentence. I would say EM is trigger happy in that he has a very short fuse if things arent going the right way. Warburton, Karanka and O’Neill were all sacked or their positions made untenable well before most fans were calling for change. So I would say its pretty irrelevant if the fans want a different manager because EM will demand change sooner.

Before Sniffer jumps on me in EMs defence when he gets the right man he will stick with them, Pedro Martins has been at Oly for 3 years now.

I did say part of the reason! My rationale was that if all the fans were backing the manager he would be less likely to sack them. He only sacked Sabri after the polls on here turned against him after all! (Imagine that's how he makes his decisions...)

I do dislike the argument that was made a lot during Sabri's time, where people basically say EM will do it anyway so it doesn't matter what we think. EM does listen to the fans (although I agree it didn't help AK, there were other things in play there though) and often it was just used as an excuse to beat the manager, just irritated me really.

[Jean_claude_killy]

I think Hughton holds all of the aces at the moment.

There is no doubt in my mind that we were heading down until Hughton brought in Krovinovic and Garner in January.

He has inherited 90% of this squad and managed to coach it into a fairly decent defensive unit; but that is not enough; nowhere near enough.

We need forwards and we need them bad - one might do, two would be ideal.

The recent downturn in form can be a blessing; imagine sticking with some of these players next season and they go and fold on us late on, just like they are doing now.

Some of these players are blowing their chance, and its no ones fault but their own.

Hughton can make a very cogent case for quality over quantity and then its up to Vretzos to back him to the hilt.

[Strawberry Avenger]

I think Hughton holds all of the aces at the moment.

There is no doubt in my mind that we were heading down until Hughton brought in Krovinovic and Garner in January.

He has inherited 90% of this squad and managed to coach it into a fairly decent defensive unit; but that is not enough; nowhere near enough.

We need forwards and we need them bad - one might do, two would be ideal.

The recent downturn in form can be a blessing; imagine sticking with some of these players next season and they go and fold on us late on, just like they are doing now.

Some of these players are blowing their chance, and its no ones fault but their own.

Hughton can make a very cogent case for quality over quantity and then its up to Vretzos to back him to the hilt.

Boiler plate reading.  Nail gunned on.  Can't fault that.   :cool:

Apparently only 5 teams have conceded less than us. Four of them in the top 4? Imagine adding that to some serious forward fire power? That would make us contenders.

SA.

[Tricky]

I think Hughton holds all of the aces at the moment.

There is no doubt in my mind that we were heading down until Hughton brought in Krovinovic and Garner in January.

He has inherited 90% of this squad and managed to coach it into a fairly decent defensive unit; but that is not enough; nowhere near enough.

We need forwards and we need them bad - one might do, two would be ideal.

The recent downturn in form can be a blessing; imagine sticking with some of these players next season and they go and fold on us late on, just like they are doing now.

Some of these players are blowing their chance, and its no ones fault but their own.

Hughton can make a very cogent case for quality over quantity and then its up to Vretzos to back him to the hilt.

Boiler plate reading.  Nail gunned on.  Can't fault that.   :cool:

Apparently only 5 teams have conceded less than us.  Four of them in the top 4?  Imagine adding that to some serious forward fire power?  That would make us contenders.

SA.

Exactly SA. These were points I was making a few weeks ago.

 It has been our lack of attacking threat that has let us down badly this season, not a poor defence. That and a midfield that hasn't done nearly enough to provide better protection to our defence and offer better support to our front line.

[Jon Moss]

One thing is for sure Chris Hughton has been here long enough to know exactly what we need to be challenging next season.

[Sabricadabra]

I think Hughton holds all of the aces at the moment.

There is no doubt in my mind that we were heading down until Hughton brought in Krovinovic and Garner in January.

He has inherited 90% of this squad and managed to coach it into a fairly decent defensive unit; but that is not enough; nowhere near enough.

We need forwards and we need them bad - one might do, two would be ideal.

The recent downturn in form can be a blessing; imagine sticking with some of these players next season and they go and fold on us late on, just like they are doing now.

Some of these players are blowing their chance, and its no ones fault but their own.

Hughton can make a very cogent case for quality over quantity and then its up to Vretzos to back him to the hilt.

Boiler plate reading.  Nail gunned on.  Can't fault that.   :cool:

Apparently only 5 teams have conceded less than us.  Four of them in the top 4?  Imagine adding that to some serious forward fire power?  That would make us contenders.

SA.

This is why we aren’t far off being contenders. 

Hughton has got the foundation in place, that is, a really tight defensive unit and an organised set up where everyone knows what their role is. Add a dash of attacking penetration in the summer and more clinical finishing and we will be a top 6 side next season.

[Salvatore Matrecano]

Good grief, its not a recipe book. Far too simplistic a view that just signing a few forward players will sort us out. I do think CH can do it but he cant magically turn a team set up to be tight defensively into a free flowing attacking unit overnight. He needs to work with the squad over the summer, integrate any new members and redefine how we play.