NFFC Financial Talk

[wassy04]

It's completely unrealistic to expect to not make bad signings.

Why is it?

That's like the argument earlier where I told it was completely unrealistic for a company to turn a profit (dispute the fact some do) without any actually explanation as to why it's impossible.

Norwich only made profit due to parachute payments

Except the year above I'm talking about they didn't have any

Facts, do you understand them?

Show me a single club that has never made a bad signing?

[wassy04]

It's completely unrealistic to expect to not make bad signings.

Why is it?

That's like the argument earlier where I told it was completely unrealistic for a company to turn a profit (dispute the fact some do) without any actually explanation as to why it's impossible.

Norwich only made profit due to parachute payments

Except the year above I'm talking about they didn't have any

Facts, do you understand them?

Which year is that sorry?

https://www.canaries.co.uk/News/2019/nov...-accounts/

Must be from before 2010 I guess, given this article states clearly they've had parachute payments for the previous 8 years then made a 38m operating loss the following year?

[Knocker West]

Which year is that sorry?

I'm not going to go back & find it because it's actually irrelevant to the point that there is absolutely no physical reason why a club can't turn a profit & for this endless & frankly ludicrous argument that's been spinning on for far to long now, no one has actually offered the reason why it's impossible.

Just accepting that shit happens doesn't mean it has to.

If you want further answers enroll at your local college on a basic economics course & they'll teach you what profits are & why companies can make them & that there isn't actually any real life barriers making it impossible for them to be turned.

I've already put one person in this thread on ignore for acting like an idiot, don't make me make it two.

[Salvatore Matrecano]

People are getting too hung up on individual signings being the problem. We are not in the shit this season just because Arter turned out to be useless. We didnt make a £20M loss last season just because we signed Jenkinson and DaCosta. It is the collective strategy and short termism that needs to change.

I get what KW is saying about being run sustainably and can be a vision we work towards, Barnsley did it but their supporters will forgive a season in L1 as a consequence, as you point out ours will not. Crucially our owner doesnt seem to be blessed with patience either which is one of the reasons we seem to have an all or nothing approach. I assume he didnt get to be successful by throwing good money after bad though so I hope lessons have been learned.

[Knocker West]

Show me a single club that has never made a bad signing?

Last answer, because you're being ridiculous now, no, I am not going to trawl through hundreds of years worth of football to show you examples to the patently obvious fact that it's possible for clubs to avoid bad deals.

The word "never" is a ridiculous word to throw in because again it's moving me away from anything I've ever said to make some stupid argument that I have no interest in. Of course the occasional mistake will be made, no ones said it won't but you strive not to make them, to minimize them, & to offset them with other deals, so that they are not a problem, & that has happened at most clubs on at least one occasion, & many clubs repeatedly, some for periods of years on end.

Some of you are being absolutely ridiculous on this thread now, arguing against trying to be profitable, trying to be sustainable, trying to cut out, or cover bad recruitment, it's bizarre & no I am not going to chase around the internet doing random exercises for someone to moronic to see that, because I have a better solution & that's just to ignore idiots.

[wassy04]

Which year is that sorry?

I'm not going to go back & find it because it's actually irrelevant to the point that there is absolutely no physical reason why a club can't turn a profit & for this endless & frankly ludicrous argument that's been spinning on for far to long now, no one has actually offered the reason why it's impossible.

Just accepting that S**t happens doesn't mean it has to.

If you want further answers enroll at your local college on a basic economics course & they'll teach you what profits are & why companies can make them & that there isn't actually any real life barriers making it impossible for them to be turned.

I've already put one person in this thread on ignore for acting like an idiot, don't make me make it two.

Ha, I just scrolled through the thread, your words were "if you keep looking you'll find it eventually". I'm sorry but where are the facts there? 

I offered a constructive solution too anyway, ditch parachute payments and collectively agree some controls on wages. 

No-one was suggesting it wasn't physically possible simply that it's very difficult to run at a profit and also be competitive. 

Oh by the way I'm a qualified chartered accountant, I have a vague idea how profit and loss works FYI.

[Knocker West]

It is the collective strategy and short termism that needs to change.

It is, which is the point I'm trying to make, there is no reason why we shouldn't strive to be better organised, & with better finances, by employing a better strategy & the endless arguments from people concentrating on irrelevant minute is absurd.

All these "go show me the tax result from a random 3rd division club in 1837!" are quite absurd demands, that completely miss the points being made & that is that improvement could & should be made, which is what the club itself says.

[Knocker West]

Oh by the way I'm a qualified chartered accountant, I have a vague idea how profit and loss works FYI.

Well my sympathies are with any idiot that employs you, I certainly wouldn't, based on your input in this discussion.

Like I said, you're now on ignore.

[Paplane]

Football Index have suspended their trading platform.

If anyone's interested I'm launching a new platform called Football Shirt Index, where you can invest cryptocurrency into fictional shares in Nottingham Forest shirt sponsors, & then when they get into financial trouble, like 50% of our last 4 sponsors, I can restructure the market & keep your money & I won't even charge fans a fee for that!

Given some of the economic thinking by some in this thread I'm bound to get rich!

Forest will have to get a new sponsor next year though & in all seriousness I hope we think carefully about it given the fate of 888 & FI, & the bad taste such sponsors have left in some mouths.

With respect to your enterprise ideas of yesterday, I think I'll pass.

[wassy04]

People are getting too hung up on individual signings being the problem. We are not in the S**t this season just because Arter turned out to be useless. We didnt make a £20M loss last season just because we signed Jenkinson and DaCosta. It is the collective strategy and short termism that needs to change.

I get what KW is saying about being run sustainably and can be a vision we work towards, Barnsley did it but their supporters will forgive a season in L1 as a consequence, as you point out ours will not. Crucially our owner doesnt seem to be blessed with patience either which is one of the reasons we seem to have an all or nothing approach. I assume he didnt get to be successful by throwing good money after bad though so I hope lessons have been learned.

That's not what we're saying either. Obviously it would be better if we were run more sustainably, just that people would also have to accept it makes it less likely we would be successful as we then couldn't compete on wages with the top clubs in the division. I'm not necessarily saying I would be against this as a strategy FYI, just would need to accept we'd be unlikely to go up. I mean it's not like our current strategy is working anyway so I'd be happy with a different approach.

[wassy04]

Oh by the way I'm a qualified chartered accountant, I have a vague idea how profit and loss works FYI.

Well my sympathies are with any idiot that employs you, I certainly wouldn't, based on your input in this discussion.

Like I said, you're now on ignore.

:D 

Always nice to be attacked on a personal and professional level by a complete stranger on a Friday morning.

In his defence I have wasted the last half hour on here instead of working so maybe he has a point. :P

I look forward to the point where everyone who has ever disagreed with him or doesn't like be insulted has been ignored and he's just chatting to himself.

[selborne garibaldi]

Which year is that sorry?

I'm not going to go back & find it because it's actually irrelevant to the point that there is absolutely no physical reason why a club can't turn a profit & for this endless & frankly ludicrous argument that's been spinning on for far to long now, no one has actually offered the reason why it's impossible.

Just accepting that S**t happens doesn't mean it has to.

If you want further answers enroll at your local college on a basic economics course & they'll teach you what profits are & why companies can make them & that there isn't actually any real life barriers making it impossible for them to be turned.

I've already put one person in this thread on ignore for acting like an idiot, don't make me make it two.

You are far too intelligent to allow a disagreement on ideas to become personal, aren't you?