Your Thoughts On The Current Nottingham Forest Manager

[Strawberry Avenger]

I don't see how anyone can perform at their best when failure is rewarded by a bumper lump sum payout. It may not be a deliberate attempt to lose games of course but sport is about fine margins and reduced motivation to succeed cannot be positive. Someone like Terry would have motivation perhaps as he has to prove himself as a manager.

But isn't that modern football?

There aren't any working class heroes working down the pit and that turning up on match day to do a bit of 'honest' football.

The Premier Greed (sorry, League) ripped the heart out of football.

Looks at Forest.  Look at Man City with Grealish.  In different places league wise...but the motivation and nature of the decision making has something in common.

We've gone from the open letter of slow rehabilitation of Warburton shepherding our flock (at least it bore SOME resemblance to the Forest Way...) but many were impatient for success despite that open letter (Randall may as well have not wrote it.  Because somebody at the club decided £13 million on some unproven kid was the way to go.  Had they given that money to Warburton ((or Hughton)) I doubt we'd be sitting bottom of the league.)

The people running Forest have put us here.  The responsibility lies at the very top.  Ships sink from the top.

SA.

[Alf]

Thanks Wassy.

I'd love to see a total of money we have blown on players who didn't contribute much/anything for us (Carvalho, Da Costa, Soudani, Jenks etc.) and how much that adds up with the sacking too.

For someone who's meant to be about finances, Vrentzos has made some crazy decisions.

It will only break your heart, Alf.

SA.

:D Yep. That's Forest!  :D

Just to extend your post above, let's not forget that Warburton was after John McGinn for 700k when here too. I think they wanted 2-3m, but he has stated he was working to KPI's, then got sacked for it lol.

That's the frustrating thig about all this. We were doing fine, we just needed the precious commodity of time to continue building for a few years like Warbs has at QPR.

It's all so self-inflicted.

[Strawberry Avenger]

Thanks Wassy.

I'd love to see a total of money we have blown on players who didn't contribute much/anything for us (Carvalho, Da Costa, Soudani, Jenks etc.) and how much that adds up with the sacking too.

For someone who's meant to be about finances, Vrentzos has made some crazy decisions.

It will only break your heart, Alf.

SA.

:D Yep. That's Forest!  :D

I feel a 'Righteous Brothers' song coming on...

SA.

[wassy04]

Wassy04, I mentioned before that 3-5 million is not remotely near the amount of a pay-out to sack CH, he has less then 10 months on his contract left, your numbers would indicate that he is on around £100K a week! I would hazard a guess at £20K per week max, therefore any potential pay-out would be LESS then a million. It would also NOT be paid in a lump sum and if by chance it was that figure would be reduced, also if CH find alternative employment in the next few months then the figure could be reduce to even lower numbers. No excuse not to sack the man based on any pay-off!

100% agree.

Only 10 months on his contract left, we were poised to spend millions on a striker in the transfer window.

I would imagine the cost for him and his staff would equate to 30-40k a week max. And that wouldn’t be paid as a lump sum as he would be on gardening leave.

Yes, in fact we'd have to pay this regardless anyway. 

Better to look at is as the the cost of a year's salary for a new manager plus signing on fee plus any compensation if he is in work already.

[wassy04]

I don't see how anyone can perform at their best when failure is rewarded by a bumper lump sum payout. It may not be a deliberate attempt to lose games of course but sport is about fine margins and reduced motivation to succeed cannot be positive. Someone like Terry would have motivation perhaps as he has to prove himself as a manager.

That's surely up to how clubs write contracts but just to make it clear, he's not entitled to a bumper payout. He's merely entitled to the remainder of his contract unless he agrees a settlement in which case he'd likely receive it as a lump sum. The contract is perfectly fair, it goes both ways and he can't just walk away from it either without buying out his own contract so it protects both parties.

[Salvatore Matrecano]

The point I am making is the madness of spending £1M a year on the current manager, £1M on the new manager and probably £1M we are still paying on previous mangers.
I am making the figures up now but we will be effectively paying 3 people to do 1 job and we have been doing this for years. How about we just get someone good or even just competent (cough Warburton cough) and leave them too it.

[wassy04]

If we put Reidy or Brazil in charge until the end of the season would not cost us a penny as they are already on the payroll!

This is not true, as we would likely have to adjust their contracts to reflect the short term promotions. We would also have to hire likely short term replacements for their current roles. 

Brazil has largely struggled when caretaker previously and is also hugely important to our current setup and the academy so we would be weakening that by taking him out of there. It would not be a smart move and would in fact be yet another poorly thought out short term move.

[Strawberry Avenger]

The point I am making is the madness of spending £1M a year on the current manager, £1M on the new manager and probably £1M we are still paying on previous mangers.
I am making the figures up now but we will be effectively paying 3 people to do 1 job and we have been doing this for years. How about we just get someone good or even just competent (cough Warburton cough) and leave them too it.

Yeah.  Warby's looking very 'competent' now, eh?  QPR had the patience to stick with it and let him get on with it.  That suits Warburton just fine.

Chris is competent.  We're behind in the league because Forest backed him far too late (a point that Hughton has made several times in post match.)  And didn't bother with a striker.  (You don't need them in the Championship...we'll use a magic wand instead.). Hughton has been far from glowing in praise for the players brought in (I'd say, more diplomatic.)

I guess for his next trick he'll walk on water.  But only 1 Great Oak manager achieved that. 

SA.

[wassy04]

The point I am making is the madness of spending £1M a year on the current manager, £1M on the new manager and probably £1M we are still paying on previous mangers.
I am making the figures up now but we will be effectively paying 3 people to do 1 job and we have been doing this for years. How about we just get someone good or even just competent (cough Warburton cough) and leave them too it.

I completely agree, you could make an argument that all of our previous managers have shown to be competent too. In fact you could go back to Sabri and say we could've kept hold of him too although most agreed it was time for a change (including myself for the record). 

I suppose the argument is that the grass is rarely greener and that in most cases the manager has a lot less impact than people seem to think (apart from in isolated cases like Ishamel at Barnsley) So do you keep shooting for that rare gem of a manager and spending fortunes paying compo or just stick with one and instead work on improving the squad? Players is what gets you promoted not managers.

I'm not saying I think CH can turn it around either though so it's a tough call. I would go back and keep Sabri and not appoint him at all if given the choice.

I think in this instance due to the change in direction of strategy with the new CEO it would make sense to have someone in charge that aligns to his preferred style of player and tactics so in that context it would make sense for a long term change.

[Username]

The point I am making is the madness of spending £1M a year on the current manager, £1M on the new manager and probably £1M we are still paying on previous mangers.
I am making the figures up now but we will be effectively paying 3 people to do 1 job and we have been doing this for years. How about we just get someone good or even just competent (cough Warburton cough) and leave them too it.

Do you think we should leave Hughton to it?

[Salvatore Matrecano]

The point I am making is the madness of spending £1M a year on the current manager, £1M on the new manager and probably £1M we are still paying on previous mangers.
I am making the figures up now but we will be effectively paying 3 people to do 1 job and we have been doing this for years. How about we just get someone good or even just competent (cough Warburton cough) and leave them too it.

Do you think we should leave Hughton to it?

We sacked Warburton in 14th place after not particularly backing him.
We sacked Karanka in 7th place after backing him but the hierarchy thought we should be at least 2nd.
We sacked ONeill after a 9th place finish
We sacked Sabri after finishing 7th and a poor start, I actually dont think he would have taken is down.

What we have with CH is a disastrous start, a weak looking squad and a manger who has had a full season but shown little improvement with an expensively assembled (not necessarily well assembled) squad the previous year. I would say he has a weaker case to remain in his job than any of the above, no I wouldnt leave him to it.

[Strawberry Avenger]

The point I am making is the madness of spending £1M a year on the current manager, £1M on the new manager and probably £1M we are still paying on previous mangers.
I am making the figures up now but we will be effectively paying 3 people to do 1 job and we have been doing this for years. How about we just get someone good or even just competent (cough Warburton cough) and leave them too it.

Do you think we should leave Hughton to it?

We sacked Warburton in 14th place after not particularly backing him.
We sacked Karanka in 7th place after backing him but the hierarchy thought we should be at least 2nd.
We sacked ONeill after a 9th place finish (may they burn in shame for the way they treated him.  I'm not surprised the karma bus has hit Forest with rock bottom.)
We sacked Sabri after finishing 7th and a poor start, I actually dont think he would have taken is down.  (The performances were sterile.  Gutless.  His misfiring press was beaten easily with pace, a simple cross, bang: GOAL!  Massively over rated.  He was lucky to have Sow fit twice which gave him a top 6 place - temporarily - twice.  Because without Sow?  We were a bang average and mostly toothless Championship side.)

What we have with CH is a disastrous start, a weak looking squad and a manger who has had a full season but shown little improvement with an expensively assembled (not necessarily well assembled) squad the previous year. I would say he has a weaker case to remain in his job than any of the above, no I wouldnt leave him to it.

What we had with Dane was a disastrous start to recruitment shipping 12 points in the process as we chased down our options at C and D and E on our recruitment list.  Problem with late recruitment is you're always playing catch up with those damaging '12' points flushed.

Any CEO should know the striker is a no.1 priority and Forest, true to type, left it until last minute.com.

Dane has assembled a budget cutting squad with no striker which Hughton has given no ringing endorsement of.  It's not Hughton's job to get this pound stretcher squad into some sort of shape for scraping results.

I thought 1st half vs Land of the Giants was good.  Pity the 2nd half they rough housed and long ball rugby kicked and headed/kicked past Samba (who has shipped points all season.)

Sacking managers.  It's worked out well for us, hasn't it?

Meanwhile, at QPR, one of our 'underperforming' cast-offs is flying with Plan A.

SA.