Jack Colback

[wassy04]

Going to make a few people groan now  :) just wonder if we have a habit of bigging up players in Colback’s role and thinking than they are better than they are. Dont get me wrong he is a decent signing assuming Watson leaves but hear me out.
For starters Colback is 31 in October and 17 months older than he was when he last kicked a ball. He did well season before last, we finished 9th.

Season just gone people were discussing Watson as player of the season, for me his lack of pace was exposed badly at the end, I dont buy the fantastic passing range he supposedly had either, we couldnt string 2 passes together. He was a good pro and a leader (something we badly miss now) but nothing special. 12 months ago I was one of the few on here saying he still had a part to play, he did well but to say he is one of the best players in the league is wrong.

Before those 2 we had David Vaughn who again many went on about how good he was. He was well passed it with us and he final season we were very nearly relegated yet for some reason he escaped criticism.

 Go back further still to the season under ODriscoll, he brought in Simon Gillet and everyone waffled on about how he was an undiscovered diamond. He wasnt, he was pretty poor and was quickly replaced by perennial  Championship bench warmer Gary Gardner who again fans liked because he cracked in a couple of 30 yarders. See where I am going here?
Before him was the horrendous season under Cotterill who played Jonathan Greening in the same role, he literally needed a zimmer frame to get up and down the pitch but yet again for some reason most seemed to like him. Before him Guy Moussi, great competitor and character, some brilliant games (Derby away) and some where he was pretty terrible too.

Maybe it is the natural tendency to root for the unglamorous DCM role but it is a vital one in how we currently set up. Seems to me we havent had a really good player in this role for a long time, in fact Colback stands out on that list as being the best. Just think he is best of a very average bunch.

I disagree with this, I think this shows two things. One we've clearly looked better when we've had someone decent in this position (you've missed the best one off Paul Mckenna, think how much better we looked with him). I think its clearly an important position and when we've got it right we've improved.

Secondly, just clearly our weaknesses have been in other areas for this entire time. In particular at striker and central midfield, as well as the standard long term issues at LB and GK.

[Strawberry Avenger]

Yep.

Agree Wassy.

McKenna.

SA.

[Salvatore Matrecano]

McKenna was quality yes but hewasnt a DCM, much more of a playmaker. We played more of a traditional 442 in those days, McKenna and Cohen in the centre. That was about the last time I remember a Forest side dominating the midfield in games regularly though which goes to show.

[Paplane]

McKenna was quality yes but hewasnt a DCM, much more of a playmaker. We played more of a traditional 442 in those days, McKenna and Cohen in the centre. That was about the last time I remember a Forest side dominating the midfield in games regularly though which goes to show.

I miss 4-4-2. Gives creative CM's time and space on the ball. Would only work these days if every team played it.

[GaribaldiRED]

McKenna was quality yes but hewasnt a DCM, much more of a playmaker. We played more of a traditional 442 in those days, McKenna and Cohen in the centre. That was about the last time I remember a Forest side dominating the midfield in games regularly though which goes to show.

I miss 4-4-2. Gives creative CM's time and space on the ball. Would only work these days if every team played it.

Don't understand what you mean Paplane. You have many teams that play 4-4-2 and are successful doing just that.

[GaribaldiRED]

Just to follow up on that a bit more. I don't see a massive difference between Sabri's 4-2-3-1 and a 4-4-2. If you swap the CAM with a CF that drops deep when defending along with the 2 wingers you in effect have a 4-4-2 or maybe 4-4-1-1 when defending. It's all about which type of player who plays in the CAM/CF role. It worked to perfection at Atletico Madrid with Griezmann as the CF that dropped deeper when defending. That's a proper counter attacking CF.

[Paplane]

McKenna was quality yes but hewasnt a DCM, much more of a playmaker. We played more of a traditional 442 in those days, McKenna and Cohen in the centre. That was about the last time I remember a Forest side dominating the midfield in games regularly though which goes to show.

I miss 4-4-2. Gives creative CM's time and space on the ball. Would only work these days if every team played it.

Don't understand what you mean Paplane. You have many teams that play 4-4-2 and are successful doing just that.

Not many play 2 out and out strikers. I suppose I mean I miss every team playing a classic 442, where there would be 2 CM's against 2 CM's and classic wingers up against full backs. Bring back the Neil Webbs and Franz Carrs.

[Sniffer Dog (Admin)]

If Watson leaves I wouldn't be surprised to see Colback named captain. We have Dawson of course but he won't play much.

[Shawoddyred]

If Watson leaves I wouldn't be surprised to see Colback named captain. We have Dawson of course but he won't play much.

I thought that but then argued with myself thinking that wouldn't you want your captain going into next season to have experienced the agony of the way the one just gone finished? Dunno, think there's pros and cons to that!

[tugger2018]

I still think the most important position we need to fill is the box to box central midfielder linking behind the striker with a few say 15 goals in him someone similar to Bowen was at hull get one in and we area different team

[Strawberry Avenger]

In many ways it was the box to box position that torpedoed our season.

SA.

[ozzyten10]

Would love Browne from PNE. Robust and good scoring record.