Would You Trust Recruitment With Summer 2020?

[Alf]

Alf, when is it going to sink in that it is not the transfer fees that are the problem, its the wages being demanded by the players and the agents; and we cannot afford them.

We tried to sign Grosicki, matched what WBA offered and what Hull wanted but he chose WBA because they offered him the higher wage.

We have very little option but to look abroad for players as foreign players tend to have more realistic wage demands.

When EM took over this Club wages were running at around 140% of income; that is the car crash of a Club they inherited from Fawaz.

Wages are now running at around 110% of income; the reduction has been impressive but the cold hard facts are that it is not enough.

You can quote transfer fees we have spent over the last three seasons all day long but they do not matter one bit; in fact when you consider that we have displayed a profit of 25m in the transfer market in the first two of those three seasons they become totally irrelevant.

I tell you something else Alf; the very same people who are calling for us to gamble now in the hope we get promotion will be the first to stick the boot in when the next embargo or points deduction arrives in the post.

But the wages are only an issue because we've already clogged up the wage bill with such crap signings in the first place.

Muric, Semedo, Bostock, Jenks etc. we'd have more cash free for wages if the current regime hadn't burdened us with so much crap initially.

The whole problem is the "hit & hope" transfer policy, which further cogs up that wage bill. A policy which I don't want to continue throughout the Summer. 

Also, if we can afford 2m for Da Costa, we can afford to use that transfer fee out over wages for better quality loans. 2m over 1/2 a year is 77k/wk. Plus you can add Da Costa's wages on top of that, est 10k/wk, and that's 87k/wk wages we can put towards someone like Callum Robinson or Scott Hogan. 

Da Costa, Adama, Bong - I'd sooner have seen us sign 1 quality player than 3 hit & hopes. 

I appreciate it isn't that simple in reality, but we seem to be stuck in a never ending circle of bringing crap in, shipping crap out. I think we'd be better off trying a different approach.

[Duncan Mckenzie]

I tell you something else Alf; the very same people who are calling for us to gamble now in the hope we get promotion will be the first to stick the boot in when the next embargo or points deduction arrives in the post.

Well said JCK.

I get brassed off when people have a go at our owners for not putting their hand in their pocket.

Marinakis is loaded beyond belief, having money to spend is one thing but actually being able/allowed to spend it is another thing entirely.

People forget far too easily what state this club was in when Marinakis took over. It wasn't fit for purpose.

[ThePromisedLand]

Not aware that folks are having a pop at the big man not spending money.
I think the debate here is how he is spending it.

[Duncan Mckenzie]

How long have the present recruitement team been in place? Just a few months.

Weve been there before with what Alf is crying out for and where did that get us?

We've had British COE's, British Scouts, signed 100's of players with experience of playing in the British Leagues and it got us where exactly?

[ThePromisedLand]

You’re very defensive this morning Duncan?
They may only have been here a short while - but the latest window, by any yardstick, was a disappointment ( and I’m not referring to the level of investment ).

[Madforit]

Alf, when is it going to sink in that it is not the transfer fees that are the problem, its the wages being demanded by the players and the agents; and we cannot afford them.

We tried to sign Grosicki, matched what WBA offered and what Hull wanted but he chose WBA because they offered him the higher wage.

We have very little option but to look abroad for players as foreign players tend to have more realistic wage demands.

When EM took over this Club wages were running at around 140% of income; that is the car crash of a Club they inherited from Fawaz.

Wages are now running at around 110% of income; the reduction has been impressive but the cold hard facts are that it is not enough.

You can quote transfer fees we have spent over the last three seasons all day long but they do not matter one bit; in fact when you consider that we have displayed a profit of 25m in the transfer market in the first two of those three seasons they become totally irrelevant.

I tell you something else Alf; the very same people who are calling for us to gamble now in the hope we get promotion will be the first to stick the boot in when the next embargo or points deduction arrives in the post.

But the wages are only an issue because we've already clogged up the wage bill with such crap signings in the first place.

Muric, Semedo, Bostock, Jenks etc. we'd have more cash free for wages if the current regime hadn't burdened us with so much crap initially.

The whole problem is the "hit & hope" transfer policy, which further cogs up that wage bill. A policy which I don't want to continue throughout the Summer. 

Also, if we can afford 2m for Da Costa, we can afford to use that transfer fee out over wages for better quality loans. 2m over 1/2 a year is 77k/wk. Plus you can add Da Costa's wages on top of that, est 10k/wk, and that's 87k/wk wages we can put towards someone like Callum Robinson or Scott Hogan. 

Da Costa, Adama, Bong - I'd sooner have seen us sign 1 quality player than 3 hit & hopes. 

I appreciate it isn't that simple in reality, but we seem to be stuck in a never ending circle of bringing crap in, shipping crap out. I think we'd be better off trying a different approach.


Totally agree^

[Duncan Mckenzie]

I am just looking at the bigger picture TPL.

In the past I have had a pop at our recruitment too and called for more players who know the British Leagues although it was mainly Mendes I was not happy with.

But we have been there and it got us nowhere. Infact it got us relegated once and almost a second time.

This is in comparison to our present recruitment which sees us sitting in a play off place.

I'm sorry but I just don't understand it. Maybe it's just me, I don't know.

[Jean_claude_killy]

The Club accounts paint a very different picture; wages are clearly heading in the right direction.

You quote that loan players are clogging up the wage bill, they are not.

And we cannot sign the one quality player because they want the quality wage to go with it.

I did a back of the fag packet calculation on what our average wage bill is per player; take out the under 23's and you are left with an average wage of around 17 to 18k per week.

What do you think will happen if you sign a Grosicki on 35k per week?

It drives a wedge in what is a very happy dressing room.

I notice you are now advocating Scott Hogan after his good start for Birmingham; I did not see you mention him when he was absolutely shite for Stoke or Villa.

The guys doing the recruiting do not have the benefit of hindsight like you do.

There is not one single Club out there who are 100% successful with their transfers, not one, and that is because it is not an exact science; come the end of the season we will be in a very good position with our squad and perfectly placed to build.

[Alf]

The Club accounts paint a very different picture; wages are clearly heading in the right direction.

You quote that loan players are clogging up the wage bill, they are not.

And we cannot sign the one quality player because they want the quality wage to go with it.

I did a back of the fag packet calculation on what our average wage bill is per player; take out the under 23's and you are left with an average wage of around 17 to 18k per week.

What do you think will happen if you sign a Grosicki on 35k per week?

It drives a wedge in what is a very happy dressing room.

I notice you are now advocating Scott Hogan after his good start for Birmingham; I did not see you mention him when he was absolutely shite for Stoke or Villa.

The guys doing the recruiting do not have the benefit of hindsight like you do.

There is not one single Club out there who are 100% successful with their transfers, not one, and that is because it is not an exact science; come the end of the season we will be in a very good position with our squad and perfectly placed to build.

If loan players aren't clogging up the wage bill, why are you using the wage bill as an excuse for not loaning players like Hogan, Freeman, Robinson etc?

No it doesn't mate, that's a total myth. These players want to play in the Prem and will welcome quality which allows them to do that. You think Grabban's gonna moan he's got Grosicki supplying him as opposed to Ameobi? If we go up, the current players become Prem players, and will get a better wage by default (hell their bonus this year alone will keep them happy.) They really won't moan if additional quality arrives to help them go up.

Regards Hogan, what bizarre comment. I don't scout for the club. 

No-one's expecting us to be 100% successful. I'd just like us to adjust our approach & setup.

[Mcforest]

I just feel and this is my own view on the transfers that this summer they went for squad fillers, rather than players who can make a difference, in the hope that the first 11 will get us over the line. Thought process being why have these high wages on the books when they wouldn’t be part of a premiership team. What you need in the championship is different to what you need to survive in the premiership so buying players at high prices for 6 months didn’t fit in the plans as they knew if we when up they would need to pretty much replace the whole team.

[Camms]

How long have the present recruitement team been in place? Just a few months.

Weve been there before with what Alf is crying out for and where did that get us?

We've had British COE's, British Scouts, signed 100's of players with experience of playing in the British Leagues and it got us where exactly?

Alf didn't answer so I will.

It got us nowhere.

It's now 2020 not 1999.

We have a modern European set up.

Lets give it more time.

[wassy04]

Am I the only one that thinks we had a great summer then? Signed 5 players for minimal fees that play every game. 2 of those are possibly our two most important players