Dyche Out

[BomberBowyer]

That pretty much nails it for me. I was pro Dyche and could never understand my 2 Everton mates moaning about him constantly. Now I get it. Absolute fraud.

Yeah another one who pulled the wool over owners eyes!

What’s your view Widdow? You usually have good snippets. Do you think he had to go?

Yes. Which is a shame really. He got the club, he didnt get the players (or they didnt get him)

Yeah really hoped that it would work out but seems he lost a lot of the players and fans.

[Tricky]

Right here we go.................

I havent said much on here lately, mainly because I am sick and tired of all of the shenanigans taking place at the club (this stems from last season BTW). So rather than come on here bitching and moaning and pissing everyone off, I decided to stay out of sight, just quietly go about my business and just read other posters comments. I will not comment further on the comments!

Like everyone else on here, I was incensed by Nuno and his apparent staging of his dismissal. But lets get real now, last season should not have happened! We seriously over performed in the league, but we were also very, very lucky that a lot of the big 6 struggled for the best part of the season and we somehow managed to benefit from that. Then around the start of last year, a lot of those teams (Man City, Chelsea, Newcastle) stated to turn their form around and started picking up the wins. At the same time, other teams started to suss out ways to destabilise our game plan and eventually, we ended up at the standard we should have been at, not the top of the table side we were for the first 2 thirds of last season. So, as a result of the freak of nature season we had last season, everybody's expectations and aspirations (including Mr Marinakis) went into an unrealistic overdrive. That luck that we had over the start of last season continued its rich vein when we found ourselves in the Europa League this season and not the Conference League (yes I know that was down to Palace f*****g up, but it was still a stroke of luck that we ended up where we are at now). However, during the first part of the season, despite us picking up wins here, there and everywhere, a lot of our performances were hardly the stuff true contenders for titles would expect. A lot of them were smash and grab jobs, whereby we would be under the cosh for large periods of the game, but then get a fast breakaway and hit the opposition with counter attacks, which were often very well executed. Thank you Elanga and Wood! This worked best against teams that liked to use the high press and leave their back door open. But then teams worked out not to use the high press on us and would use the low block instead, giving us much more of the possession and more of the pitch to work in when we were in possession, but at the same time shutting off our supply lines to our pacey wingers and counter attacks. We didn't know what to do then and our results started to dip. But please dont kid yourselves that the football we were bringing to the table at the start of last season was free-flowing, prestige football. It wasn't. A lot of it was shit or bust! Yes, there were moments of total excitement and some wonderful football, but not to the extent some seem to remember it was like.

Then in the summer, it all went to ratshit! Edu started his role in earnest and for some reason, Nuno wasnt happy. I dont know what went on with Edu, Nuno and Marinakis and I am certainly not going to speculate or assume I know what went on, because I don't. 

Then we played Brentford on the first day of the season and well and truly beat them well. What a lot of people seem to have overlooked is that the Brentford match was their first game with a different manager, playing in a completely different way to what they were used to, having lost their main striker just a few days before. At the same time, Nuno decided to light the touchpaper about our summer business not being conducted soon enough etc etc. So Nuno put Marinakis in a position where he either bent over and let Nuno f**k him over or he sack him. He chose the latter!

This though caught Marinakis out, as he did not expect to be looking for a new Manager, especially as he had just given Nuno a new contract. So Marinakis was now caught out, as he obviously wasnt planning on making changes at the top table. So he turned to his new mate Ange, who had recently been relieved of his duties at Tottenham, probably more in desperation and hope than in any logical or tactical hindsight. What an absolute clusterfuck that turned out to be! He had to go and go he went! So now Marinakis was back to square one!

So he turned to a former reserve player and current season ticket holder in Sean Dyche, who he knew would bring with him two former favourite players in Ian Woan and Steve Stone. Guaranteed to please the fans right? Initially to some extent yes! But then we start hearing that Dyche's training methods were a bit hard and tiring for our prima donna players and they were tired (Martin O' Neill anyone?). I'm sorry, but we are paying these so called athletes major bucks, so it isnt unfair to expect them to train hard in order to become fitter! These same so called athletes are supposed to be at the top table when it comes to their profession, but between them last night, despite having 35 attempts at goal, they manage 10 on target, but only really force Jose Sa into making one decent save and didn't manage to find the back of the net once. The predictability of some of those players last night was shameful. CHO and Hutchinson, for example, both constantly having to cut back onto their stronger foot to put diagonal balls into the box was embarrassing. Last season CHO was mixing it up by either cutting back or getting to the by-line and putting the crosses in. His blatant and obvious refusal to pass to Lucca was totally unprofessional and petulant (WTF was that all about?) How much of that was down to the managers instructions or was it down to their own choice? Who knows? Dyche, like Ange before him, were never going to be the right choice of Manager our club needs for the type of players we have got. They were, IMO, desperation appointments due to some extent down to the fact Marinakis wasnt expecting what happened.

So now we are appointing Vitor Periera. Another manager that has a failed PL pedigree. How long is he likely to remain at the helm? Who knows? For me, it will depend on what style he will try to bring into the club. As he is also Portuguese, I would hope he uses similar tactics to those Nuno deployed. Just with plans B, C, D+ if needed and a more astute substitution policy. Only time will tell.

If we still get relegated at the end of this season, do we stick with Pereira or do we f**k him off as well? To some extent, it does depend on the style of play he brings to the table. But whatever happens, this season is going to be very, very expensive one for Marinakis, having to pay off all those managers (and backroom staff) compensation.

I really feel for our fans, especially those that fork out week after week, home, away or abroad, to be constantly drip fed the shite that our club keeps throwing up. They deserve better. All fans of Nottingham Forest F.C. deserve better!

I will now slink back into my hole and continue to observe, as I for one have had enough now of all of this debacle. I have more important things in my life that I need to concentrate on and if it means doing it without the distraction of the headcase antics at N.F.F.C. then I will do so. I hope things do improve now and stabilise for the benefit of you all................................. but somehow, I doubt it!!

[Sniffer Dog (Admin)]

Good read that Tricky lad.

Thank you.

[Salvatore Matrecano]

Good read Tricks

You do know it’s obligatory on this forum to either blame Dyche or Edu for absolutely everything including the roadworks on the A52 don’t you? You seem to have done neither ;)

All the best mate, don’t blame you for staying off here at times.

[JohnG]

Agree with most of the tricky and you summarise well, but in terms of fans not deserving....some for me have become privileged based on last season. We've had booing and negative chants at half time at 0-0 in both the FA Cup and Europa. I'm not one to boo my own team ever, but I understand the need to show displeasure how a game has gone at times.

But that for me, and the Ange chants at one of his first home games shines some of our fans in a bad light.

[ozzyten10]

I fear we have blown it here. Yes last night was terrible but his stats generally give us a fighting chance of staying up. Changing is a huge gamble and whatever anyone says about Dyche - he deeply cared about the club.
Maybe some of these players aren’t what we think they are. Anderson for example really pissed me off last night - taking 4 touches when one would do. CHO end product last night couldn’t have been worse if he tried - the break away he was sublime then got in the box and played a horror of a pass.
The pressure got to those players last night and we can blame Dyche all we like but bloody hell we played the worst team I’ve seen in the Premiership.
I hated the football but with Dyche you get percentages and consistency which is the safer bet to where we are.
The gamble may pay off but one thing is for sure these players can’t hide behind another manager…

[McDurban]

When Dyche was appointed, I suggested this was the most talented squad he has had at his disposal and it would be interesting to see what he could do with it.
Against Wolves, we saw (not for the first time) not much and it was only getting worse with each game.
Changing managers I believe may well save the season for Forest.
At worst it will be the same result... relegation.

[DeesideRed]

When Dyche was appointed, I suggested this was the most talented squad he has had at his disposal and it would be interesting to see what he could do with it.
Against Wolves, we saw (not for the first time) not much and it was only getting worse with each game.
Changing managers I believe may well save the season for Forest.
At worst it will be the same result... relegation.

For what its worth I think its more down to style. 

Dyche's greatest success came at Burnley, where the players would literally run through walls for him. His style is built on shutting other teams down and then scoring in transitions or from set pieces. We saw some of that in the early stages where i actually think the players bought into it. After Ange and the results being so bad I think someone coming in and saying right lads, lets keep it tight and go back to being solid was welcomed by all. 

What I find interesting is the better performances all came in those games where playing in that manner was warranted or indeed expected. Hence your Liverpool and Spurs wins and your Arsenal and Man City games (to some extent you put in Palace 2nd half). Now the interesting bit of debate is whether Dyche, in all his years the underdog, has the ability to coach at a team where they are deemed the better side, or in fact, expected to win and win comfortably. Indeed you throw the players into the mix, humans with emotions and thoughts of their own, were they willing to follow the gameplan when they themselves felt they were better? 

I dont think you can say it was getting worse each game, as I believe you're referencing the games you believe Forest to be the better side. As I say, all those we weren't we were actually ok.

[ToryTom]

I think it was the right decision to relieve Dyche of his duties but would have preferred it to have been done sooner. It was obvious from the deterioration in performances that we were going to be in big trouble, which we are. Not beating that Wolves team on Tuesday was possibly the worse individual result we have had since returning to the Premier League. They were abysmal. The Leeds performance was also dire and even in most of the victories the underlying stats from those games were worrying. Against Brentford we had 3 shots and scored two goals. However, credit where credit is due. I think Dyche did improve our defending at set pieces. Arsenal are as effective as any team at them and had loads against us which we defended. Our defending in open play still left a lot to be desired especially when Murillo is missing. Lets hope the new manager whoever that will be can get a better balance between attacking and defending. This season we went from one extreme to the other.

[Jimmygordon]

Simon Jordan is right about getting the opinion of players from 2 minutes in.


Jim White and Simon Jordan discuss Nottingham Forest's decision to sack their third manager of the season, with Sean Dyche suffering the same fate as Nuno Espirito Santo and Ange Postecoglou!

[wassy04]

When Dyche was appointed, I suggested this was the most talented squad he has had at his disposal and it would be interesting to see what he could do with it.
Against Wolves, we saw (not for the first time) not much and it was only getting worse with each game.
Changing managers I believe may well save the season for Forest.
At worst it will be the same result... relegation.

For what its worth I think its more down to style. 

Dyche's greatest success came at Burnley, where the players would literally run through walls for him. His style is built on shutting other teams down and then scoring in transitions or from set pieces. We saw some of that in the early stages where i actually think the players bought into it. After Ange and the results being so bad I think someone coming in and saying right lads, lets keep it tight and go back to being solid was welcomed by all. 

What I find interesting is the better performances all came in those games where playing in that manner was warranted or indeed expected. Hence your Liverpool and Spurs wins and your Arsenal and Man City games (to some extent you put in Palace 2nd half). Now the interesting bit of debate is whether Dyche, in all his years the underdog, has the ability to coach at a team where they are deemed the better side, or in fact, expected to win and win comfortably. Indeed you throw the players into the mix, humans with emotions and thoughts of their own, were they willing to follow the gameplan when they themselves felt they were better? 

I dont think you can say it was getting worse each game, as I believe you're referencing the games you believe Forest to be the better side. As I say, all those we weren't we were actually ok.

Apparently Dyche has never won a game in prem where his teams have more than 60% possession, think they said it was 12 times it'd happened. Sums it up pretty well I think.

[Paplane]

Simon Jordan is right about getting the opinion of players from 2 minutes in.


Jim White and Simon Jordan discuss Nottingham Forest's decision to sack their third manager of the season, with Sean Dyche suffering the same fate as Nuno Espirito Santo and Ange Postecoglou!

I like Jordan a lot but he can be an idiot sometimes. If he owned a group of players worth something like half a billion pounds, and was set to lose in the region of £150/200m by getting relegated I'm pretty sure his principles might change. I'm sure Marinakis will have sourced many different opinions, not just the players, but above all he will have seen with his own eyes how performance levels were dropping under Dyche, just at the business end of the season.