Arsenal - Nottingham Forest

[JoeWorrallsBrain]

It's only one game, and its too soon to panic, but that first game showed NO development of our tactics and no better squad management from Cooper than last year.

1.  Aurier should not be playing in place of Neco Williams.  Aurier shows flashes of offensive iniative, but his overconfidence in his ball handling abilities and his lack of pace is a liability against stronger opponents.
2.  Worrall can only play when there is a back 5.  He is too slow otherwise, and handles the ball too poorly, against the top teams.
3.  The lineup we commit to needs to be capable of putting all of our best players on the pitch at once.  It is unacceptable that our coach can't figure out how to put Awonyi and Johnson on the field at the same time.  We don't have enough elite players that we can afford to have any of them out of the lineup, barring injuries.
4.  MGW should be playing in the midfield, not on the wing.
5.  Johnson should be playing on the wing, not it the centre.
6.  We will lose more games than we will win if we surrender 85% possession every time we face a top 10 club.

Put another way, we're making the same mistakes we made last year.

The off season was a failure when we failed to recruit upgraded midfielders and central defenders.

Again, it's early, but it sure looks like it's going to be another struggle just to stave off relegation.

2. Everyone is aware of thus and we played a back five and he contained the 2nd best team in the league.
3. Taiwo was coming back from injury. 

We narrowly lost to an excellent team away from home ffs. We got battered by them last year, clear improvement. They only created a handful of chances as showed by the xG of 0.6. Basically, glory piece of skill and a wonder goal. Jonno had easily the best chance too.

Why do people have such ridiculous and unreleastic expectations. Its so infuriating, if you're going to be annoyed at narrowly losing at Arsenal, I'm not sure you're going to ever enjoy following a football team.

2.  He didn't contain the second best team.  When he was exposed one on one (which was inevitable) the ball was slotted between his legs (because he couldn't close down the shooter) for the first goal.  In general, Worrall plays too far off his mark inside the box, even when the opposing team is moving the ball across goal rather than running at the defence.  My point is that you can't have players in your lineup who are liabilities and who force you into formations to support them, and then still have them fail, at the additional expense of any attempt at competing.
3.  That doesn't explain why Cooper took Johnson off when he brought Awoniyi on.  I don't think Cooper can conceive of a formation where they both can start the game.

Arsenal is a better team than Forest at this moment.  However, it is difficult to score in the Premier League, and that means underdogs always have a chance, as long they don't resign themselves to defeat (or a tie) from the outset.  It's too early in this season to be playing for strategic 0-0 draws.

I'm not annoyed that we lost to Arsenal.  I'm annoyed that we didn't attempt to win.

[wassy04]

It's only one game, and its too soon to panic, but that first game showed NO development of our tactics and no better squad management from Cooper than last year.

1.  Aurier should not be playing in place of Neco Williams.  Aurier shows flashes of offensive iniative, but his overconfidence in his ball handling abilities and his lack of pace is a liability against stronger opponents.
2.  Worrall can only play when there is a back 5.  He is too slow otherwise, and handles the ball too poorly, against the top teams.
3.  The lineup we commit to needs to be capable of putting all of our best players on the pitch at once.  It is unacceptable that our coach can't figure out how to put Awonyi and Johnson on the field at the same time.  We don't have enough elite players that we can afford to have any of them out of the lineup, barring injuries.
4.  MGW should be playing in the midfield, not on the wing.
5.  Johnson should be playing on the wing, not it the centre.
6.  We will lose more games than we will win if we surrender 85% possession every time we face a top 10 club.

Put another way, we're making the same mistakes we made last year.

The off season was a failure when we failed to recruit upgraded midfielders and central defenders.

Again, it's early, but it sure looks like it's going to be another struggle just to stave off relegation.

2. Everyone is aware of thus and we played a back five and he contained the 2nd best team in the league.
3. Taiwo was coming back from injury. 

We narrowly lost to an excellent team away from home ffs. We got battered by them last year, clear improvement. They only created a handful of chances as showed by the xG of 0.6. Basically, glory piece of skill and a wonder goal. Jonno had easily the best chance too.

Why do people have such ridiculous and unreleastic expectations. Its so infuriating, if you're going to be annoyed at narrowly losing at Arsenal, I'm not sure you're going to ever enjoy following a football team.

2.  He didn't contain the second best team.  When he was exposed one on one (which was inevitable) the ball was slotted between his legs (because he couldn't close down the shooter) for the first goal.  In general, Worrall plays too far off his mark inside the box, even when the opposing team is moving the ball across goal rather than running at the defence.  My point is that you can't have players in your lineup who are liabilities and who force you into formations to support them, and then still have them fail, at the additional expense of any attempt at competing.
3.  That doesn't explain why Cooper took Johnson off when he brought Awoniyi on.  I don't think Cooper can conceive of a formation where they both can start the game.

Arsenal is a better team than Forest at this moment.  However, it is difficult to score in the Premier League, and that means underdogs always have a chance, as long they don't resign themselves to defeat (or a tie) from the outset.  It's too early in this season to playing for strategic 0-0 draws.

I'm not annoyed that we lost to Arsenal.  I'm annoyed that we didn't attempt to win.

I'm sorry but that's bs. We shouldn't be trying to win away at Arsenal, we would get battered. Our strategy was perfectly effective and nearly got a positive result. We have clear deficiencies in the team at CB and CM, amplified by the injuries to our two best CBs. Protecting them and limiting Arsenal to long range chances was a successful strategy and bodes well for the rest of the season.

[andy1236660]

It's only one game, and its too soon to panic, but that first game showed NO development of our tactics and no better squad management from Cooper than last year.

1.  Aurier should not be playing in place of Neco Williams.  Aurier shows flashes of offensive iniative, but his overconfidence in his ball handling abilities and his lack of pace is a liability against stronger opponents.
2.  Worrall can only play when there is a back 5.  He is too slow otherwise, and handles the ball too poorly, against the top teams.
3.  The lineup we commit to needs to be capable of putting all of our best players on the pitch at once.  It is unacceptable that our coach can't figure out how to put Awonyi and Johnson on the field at the same time.  We don't have enough elite players that we can afford to have any of them out of the lineup, barring injuries.
4.  MGW should be playing in the midfield, not on the wing.
5.  Johnson should be playing on the wing, not it the centre.
6.  We will lose more games than we will win if we surrender 85% possession every time we face a top 10 club.

Put another way, we're making the same mistakes we made last year.

The off season was a failure when we failed to recruit upgraded midfielders and central defenders.

Again, it's early, but it sure looks like it's going to be another struggle just to stave off relegation.

2. Everyone is aware of thus and we played a back five and he contained the 2nd best team in the league.
3. Taiwo was coming back from injury. 

We narrowly lost to an excellent team away from home ffs. We got battered by them last year, clear improvement. They only created a handful of chances as showed by the xG of 0.6. Basically, glory piece of skill and a wonder goal. Jonno had easily the best chance too.

Why do people have such ridiculous and unreleastic expectations. Its so infuriating, if you're going to be annoyed at narrowly losing at Arsenal, I'm not sure you're going to ever enjoy following a football team.

2.  He didn't contain the second best team.  When he was exposed one on one (which was inevitable) the ball was slotted between his legs (because he couldn't close down the shooter) for the first goal.  In general, Worrall plays too far off his mark inside the box, even when the opposing team is moving the ball across goal rather than running at the defence.  My point is that you can't have players in your lineup who are liabilities and who force you into formations to support them, and then still have them fail, at the additional expense of any attempt at competing.
3.  That doesn't explain why Cooper took Johnson off when he brought Awoniyi on.  I don't think Cooper can conceive of a formation where they both can start the game.

Arsenal is a better team than Forest at this moment.  However, it is difficult to score in the Premier League, and that means underdogs always have a chance, as long they don't resign themselves to defeat (or a tie) from the outset.  It's too early in this season to playing for strategic 0-0 draws.

I'm not annoyed that we lost to Arsenal.  I'm annoyed that we didn't attempt to win.

Back again, confusing opinion for facts. The fact that you say 'Arsenal is' undermines all the bombast.

[JoeWorrallsBrain]

It's only one game, and its too soon to panic, but that first game showed NO development of our tactics and no better squad management from Cooper than last year.

1.  Aurier should not be playing in place of Neco Williams.  Aurier shows flashes of offensive iniative, but his overconfidence in his ball handling abilities and his lack of pace is a liability against stronger opponents.
2.  Worrall can only play when there is a back 5.  He is too slow otherwise, and handles the ball too poorly, against the top teams.
3.  The lineup we commit to needs to be capable of putting all of our best players on the pitch at once.  It is unacceptable that our coach can't figure out how to put Awonyi and Johnson on the field at the same time.  We don't have enough elite players that we can afford to have any of them out of the lineup, barring injuries.
4.  MGW should be playing in the midfield, not on the wing.
5.  Johnson should be playing on the wing, not it the centre.
6.  We will lose more games than we will win if we surrender 85% possession every time we face a top 10 club.

Put another way, we're making the same mistakes we made last year.

The off season was a failure when we failed to recruit upgraded midfielders and central defenders.

Again, it's early, but it sure looks like it's going to be another struggle just to stave off relegation.

2. Everyone is aware of thus and we played a back five and he contained the 2nd best team in the league.
3. Taiwo was coming back from injury. 

We narrowly lost to an excellent team away from home ffs. We got battered by them last year, clear improvement. They only created a handful of chances as showed by the xG of 0.6. Basically, glory piece of skill and a wonder goal. Jonno had easily the best chance too.

Why do people have such ridiculous and unreleastic expectations. Its so infuriating, if you're going to be annoyed at narrowly losing at Arsenal, I'm not sure you're going to ever enjoy following a football team.

2.  He didn't contain the second best team.  When he was exposed one on one (which was inevitable) the ball was slotted between his legs (because he couldn't close down the shooter) for the first goal.  In general, Worrall plays too far off his mark inside the box, even when the opposing team is moving the ball across goal rather than running at the defence.  My point is that you can't have players in your lineup who are liabilities and who force you into formations to support them, and then still have them fail, at the additional expense of any attempt at competing.
3.  That doesn't explain why Cooper took Johnson off when he brought Awoniyi on.  I don't think Cooper can conceive of a formation where they both can start the game.

Arsenal is a better team than Forest at this moment.  However, it is difficult to score in the Premier League, and that means underdogs always have a chance, as long they don't resign themselves to defeat (or a tie) from the outset.  It's too early in this season to playing for strategic 0-0 draws.

I'm not annoyed that we lost to Arsenal.  I'm annoyed that we didn't attempt to win.

Back again, confusing opinion for facts. The fact that you say 'Arsenal is' undermines all the bombast.

Almost everything written in this forum is opinion.  If you have nothing to say about someone else's opinion, the best approach would be not to post.

[Salvatore Matrecano]

Not going to have a go at you JWB and yes your opinion as valid as anyone elses when you have at least taken the time to make a structured argument.

Oddly enough pretty much agree with you on all points 1-6 ( bit harsh on Wozza maybe) and certainly at home games that’s exactly what we ought to be doing. Away at Arsenal is a different matter though, personally I dont want us to get stuffed 5 or 6 every time we play a top 6 team and end up with a -35 GD.
Reckon most would agree on what our strongest team is but I don’t accept we got the tactics wrong on Saturday.
Should we do the same on Friday evening (we won’t) you would have every right to come back and criticise.

[Paplane]

It's only one game, and its too soon to panic, but that first game showed NO development of our tactics and no better squad management from Cooper than last year.

He's absolutely correct about this. The tactics and approach are exactly the same.

[wassy04]

It's only one game, and its too soon to panic, but that first game showed NO development of our tactics and no better squad management from Cooper than last year.

He's absolutely correct about this. The tactics and approach are exactly the same.

What's the problem with this? These tactics were pretty effective when implemented for the last few months last year and with Taiwo fit.

[zicorice]

It's only one game, and its too soon to panic, but that first game showed NO development of our tactics and no better squad management from Cooper than last year.

He's absolutely correct about this. The tactics and approach are exactly the same.

But carried out far more effectively than last season in same fixture. A Jonno finish or VAR check from nicking a brilliant away point.

[Tricky]

It's only one game, and its too soon to panic, but that first game showed NO development of our tactics and no better squad management from Cooper than last year.

1.  Aurier should not be playing in place of Neco Williams.  Aurier shows flashes of offensive iniative, but his overconfidence in his ball handling abilities and his lack of pace is a liability against stronger opponents.
2.  Worrall can only play when there is a back 5.  He is too slow otherwise, and handles the ball too poorly, against the top teams.
3.  The lineup we commit to needs to be capable of putting all of our best players on the pitch at once.  It is unacceptable that our coach can't figure out how to put Awonyi and Johnson on the field at the same time.  We don't have enough elite players that we can afford to have any of them out of the lineup, barring injuries.
4.  MGW should be playing in the midfield, not on the wing.
5.  Johnson should be playing on the wing, not it the centre.
6.  We will lose more games than we will win if we surrender 85% possession every time we face a top 10 club.

Put another way, we're making the same mistakes we made last year.

The off season was a failure when we failed to recruit upgraded midfielders and central defenders.

Again, it's early, but it sure looks like it's going to be another struggle just to stave off relegation.

2. Everyone is aware of thus and we played a back five and he contained the 2nd best team in the league.
3. Taiwo was coming back from injury. 

We narrowly lost to an excellent team away from home ffs. We got battered by them last year, clear improvement. They only created a handful of chances as showed by the xG of 0.6. Basically, glory piece of skill and a wonder goal. Jonno had easily the best chance too.

Why do people have such ridiculous and unreleastic expectations. Its so infuriating, if you're going to be annoyed at narrowly losing at Arsenal, I'm not sure you're going to ever enjoy following a football team.

2.  He didn't contain the second best team.  When he was exposed one on one (which was inevitable) the ball was slotted between his legs (because he couldn't close down the shooter) for the first goal.  In general, Worrall plays too far off his mark inside the box, even when the opposing team is moving the ball across goal rather than running at the defence.  My point is that you can't have players in your lineup who are liabilities and who force you into formations to support them, and then still have them fail, at the additional expense of any attempt at competing.
3.  That doesn't explain why Cooper took Johnson off when he brought Awoniyi on.  I don't think Cooper can conceive of a formation where they both can start the game.

Arsenal is a better team than Forest at this moment.  However, it is difficult to score in the Premier League, and that means underdogs always have a chance, as long they don't resign themselves to defeat (or a tie) from the outset.  It's too early in this season to playing for strategic 0-0 draws.

I'm not annoyed that we lost to Arsenal.  I'm annoyed that we didn't attempt to win.

Back again, confusing opinion for facts. The fact that you say 'Arsenal is' undermines all the bombast.

Almost everything written in this forum is opinion.  If you have nothing to say about someone else's opinion, the best approach would be not to post.

Joe was exposed on the one v one. Why was he exposed in that way? The ball had been dribbled past two defenders before being passed, then Boly was easily turned before it even got to the point of the shot coming in. That is hardly his fault is it? The ball deflected slightly as it was shot at goal. Joe was doing his job of trying to block the shot. Sadly the deflection took the ball away from Turner. The point at which Joe came into the equation  wasn't down to his poor play, it was just sheer bloody bad luck! But only Joe gets any blame attached to him, none of the others who were more at fault than he was.

I also note there is no criticism of either Johnson for missing the one v one on the Arsenal goal or for MGW who lost possession in a dangerous area for Arsenals second, which it has to be said was an absolute cracker by Saka

For the record, I was reasonably content with the scoreline on Saturday, given we were playing the runners-up of the best league in the world, in their own backyard. Yes, the first half we were poor but in the second half, especially after the substitutions, we looked far more impressive. So to lose to Arsenal by just the one goal at the Emirates was nothing to be ashamed at.

Remember our first season back in the Old Div 1 under Cloughie and our second away match was to Arsenal at Highbury? We lost that one 3-0 and look where we finished in the league that year!

[Paplane]

It's only one game, and its too soon to panic, but that first game showed NO development of our tactics and no better squad management from Cooper than last year.

He's absolutely correct about this. The tactics and approach are exactly the same.

But carried out far more effectively than last season in same fixture. A Jonno finish or VAR check from nicking a brilliant away point.

Yes it was Wassy but when are we going to actually try to look like a competitive side in these games? By competitive I mean try to look like we deserve to be on the same pitch, rather than a lower leage side clinging on? We look good when we start to play at the end of the games. We play Brennan up top on his own and he's useless in that position. Nothing's changed in the last 9 months.

This weekend ive watched Burnley get beaten by Man City and Wilves get beaten at Man Utd. Both teams lost like us but they had a go at least.

[wassy04]

It's only one game, and its too soon to panic, but that first game showed NO development of our tactics and no better squad management from Cooper than last year.

He's absolutely correct about this. The tactics and approach are exactly the same.

But carried out far more effectively than last season in same fixture. A Jonno finish or VAR check from nicking a brilliant away point.

Yes it was Wassy but when are we going to actually try to look like a competitive side in these games? By competitive I mean try to look like we deserve to be on the same pitch, rather than a lower leage side clinging on? We look good when we start to play at the end of the games. We play Brennan up top on his own and he's useless in that position. Nothing's changed in the last 9 months.

This weekend ive watched Burnley get beaten by Man City and Wilves get beaten at Man Utd. Both teams lost like us but they had a go at least.

Wolves yes were very impressive. Burnley were at home and the game wasn't close. Not sure they did anything more than we did really.

Also, yes Brennan is not a CF, feels like he's just being shoe-horned onto the pitch at that point. I'd probably rather see Wood start in that role if Taiwo is unavailable or different tactics.

I think how we played on Saturday was very different to how we played last year until the last few months against the top sides. We were way better at stopping them create chances whilst still maintaining our counter attacking threat. They really created very little from all that possession. Think back to Spurs away for example last year, an average team and the game was just gone almost instantly. Not many teams would be able to force their way back into a game with Arsenal at The Emirates

[Paplane]

It's only one game, and its too soon to panic, but that first game showed NO development of our tactics and no better squad management from Cooper than last year.

He's absolutely correct about this. The tactics and approach are exactly the same.

But carried out far more effectively than last season in same fixture. A Jonno finish or VAR check from nicking a brilliant away point.

Yes it was Wassy but when are we going to actually try to look like a competitive side in these games? By competitive I mean try to look like we deserve to be on the same pitch, rather than a lower leage side clinging on? We look good when we start to play at the end of the games. We play Brennan up top on his own and he's useless in that position. Nothing's changed in the last 9 months.

This weekend ive watched Burnley get beaten by Man City and Wilves get beaten at Man Utd. Both teams lost like us but they had a go at least.

Wolves yes were very impressive. Burnley were at home and the game wasn't close. Not sure they did anything more than we did really.

Also, yes Brennan is not a CF, feels like he's just being shoe-horned onto the pitch at that point. I'd probably rather see Wood start in that role if Taiwo is unavailable or different tactics.

I think how we played on Saturday was very different to how we played last year until the last few months against the top sides. We were way better at stopping them create chances whilst still maintaining our counter attacking threat. They really created very little from all that possession. Think back to Spurs away for example last year, an average team and the game was just gone almost instantly. Not many teams would be able to force their way back into a game with Arsenal at The Emirates

I just think we're in damger of thinking we performed really well when in reality we were up against an Arsenal team who were not at it and finding their feet again. They were content at 2-0 and just playing the game out. If we hadn't scored our break away goal at the end we wouldn't be so positive about the game. 

Back to the original point, how many games have we won playing this way? Very few and none away. In fact its pretty much always a L away. The tactics havent changed and the result is always the same.