Next Seasons 25

[Knocker West]

Not if he signs players like kronko Murray knockeart and bong

Haven't they all got promotion to the PL on their CV's?

I don't care what a player has on his CV, I care what he can do on a football pitch.

Hefele has promotion on his CV, but I doubt many are going to argue he's good enough as a player.

Football is a team sport, & you will have players in your squad of 25 who are better or worse than others, so the position of the team doesn't determine that all the players in the squad are identical to that position, it's possible & in fact probable, that some will be above the teams standards & some below, however they will all have the same league position as their team mates on their CV, so it isn't a basis to be hiring, or firing on.

[Sniffer Dog (Admin)]

It's called experience knocker. Experience of getting out of the league we are currently in. It can be valuable.

[Strawberry Avenger]

Not if he signs players like kronko Murray knockeart and bong

Did Hughton sign Bong?  (I think his crossing is better than Rib'.)

He clearly did sign Krov', Murray and Knocker and Garner.  Players who have made Forest more progressive going forwards (along with Cafu converted from loan to permanent.)  But we have yet to see the goals and assist return on that yet.  But they do have goals between them bar Krov'.

All 3 have materially improved the side.  Krov' may have not provided assists and goals (yet) but he has knitted middle to front and is tenacious in his efforts.

Murray was clearly an interim solution (as perhaps all the January signings may or may not be...it's survival, right?) in the absence of any kind of player like that.  We haven't got on his wavelength in terms of service yet.  His goals got Forest 3 points that day he scored a belter.  (Which may prove to be a very important 3 points.)

Knocker.  Part-time mercurial player has brought genuine quality to the wing position with assists and a beauty of a goal.  Better with him than without him.  He didn't track back vs Watford.  If he can be a bit less selfish at times.

Whether they are long term solutions is for Hughton to decide this Summer.

Do Forest need 'better' players to achieve the top 6?  Overall, I think they do.  GK, CH, FB, CM, ACM, Wing, Striker.  7 players to push the standard of competition, improve squad quality OR to give Forest something they don't have.  I don't think it has to be '14' again.  But it won't just be 3-4.  Not with so many loans and so many out of contracts to sort.

As Hughon said, 'It's going to be a busy Summer.'

SA.

[Strawberry Avenger]

It's called experience knocker. Experience of getting out of the league we are currently in. It can be valuable.

It's telling that Hughton brought Knocker, Krov', Murray in.  Definitely quality players for this league.  And they (like when Garner and Cafu play in CM) add a more progressive dimension to build upon Hughton's earlier work of making Forest more compact and more difficult to beat.  

We're just waiting on more incisive delivery to supply the strikers.  GOALS!

Though some may not think so, we're missing a fully fit Grabban.

SA.

[Strawberry Avenger]

Not if he signs players like kronko Murray knockeart and bong

Haven't they all got promotion to the PL on their CV's?

I don't care what a player has on his CV, I care what he can do on a football pitch.

Hefele has promotion on his CV, but I doubt many are going to argue he's good enough as a player.

Football is a team sport, & you will have players in your squad of 25 who are better or worse than others, so the position of the team doesn't determine that all the players in the squad are identical to that position, it's possible & in fact probable, that some will be above the teams standards & some below, however they will all have the same league position as their team mates on their CV, so it isn't a basis to be hiring, or firing on.

He seemed well off the pace on the back line.

I feel confident in Chris, we have a manager who knows about players on the pitch.  He's done it at Newcastle and Brighton.  He's been at Norwich.

Pity we didn't have him factory installed last Summer.  We'd be way ahead of schedule instead of 'behind'.  Playing catch up.  Again.

SA.

[Salvatore Matrecano]

It's called experience knocker. Experience of getting out of the league we are currently in. It can be valuable.

Too much experience = too old and not hungry enough as we have found out.

[Sniffer Dog (Admin)]

It's called experience knocker. Experience of getting out of the league we are currently in. It can be valuable.

Too much experience = too old and not hungry enough as we have found out.

Not sure if we have been let down by the likes of Murray, krovinovic and Knockaert have we?

However I see your point SM. We do need to have some experience though but I suppose we need to get the balance right between experience and younger hungry players.

[wassy04]

It's called experience knocker. Experience of getting out of the league we are currently in. It can be valuable.

Too much experience = too old and not hungry enough as we have found out.

Not sure if we have been let down by the likes of Murray, krovinovic and Knockaert have we?

However I see your point SM. We do need to have some experience though but I suppose we need to get the balance right between experience and younger hungry players.

OK but young means expensive and we're already making heavy losses. The majority of the signings past year were done on frees or loans to keep costs down.

So SM what would you do? You want us be be more sustainable, you know the only option we have for that and no-one wants to do that. (Sell worrall) rely on the current squad and hope that CH can dramatically improve them?

Not a dig by the way, I'm interested as I really don't see many good options!

[tugger2018]

Football is evolving and now a different game post pane de mic What we need is youngish fast pacey fit players that are fearless and have bags of energy and of course talenented
Unfortunately so is everybody else I hope we can keep Garner and bring back Brennan and integrate mighten and soh not sure how we get over our goal scoring problem though last season we were lucky having lolley ameobi grabban all scoring freely

[Salvatore Matrecano]

It's called experience knocker. Experience of getting out of the league we are currently in. It can be valuable.

Too much experience = too old and not hungry enough as we have found out.

Not sure if we have been let down by the likes of Murray, krovinovic and Knockaert have we?

However I see your point SM. We do need to have some experience though but I suppose we need to get the balance right between experience and younger hungry players.

OK but young means expensive and we're already making heavy losses. The majority of the signings past year were done on frees or loans to keep costs down.

So SM what would you do? You want us be be more sustainable, you know the only option we have for that and no-one wants to do that. (Sell worrall) rely on the current squad and hope that CH can dramatically improve them?

Not a dig by the way, I'm interested as I really don't see many good options!

I do get the points you are making but dont agree youth has to mean expensive. For a start wages are much cheaper, I think for example Carvalho our record signing was on £10k/ wk or less. Arter and Colback on £20k/ wk. Thats £2M a year doen the toilet for 2 players who have contributed literally nothing this season.
That doesnt mean we go down the Carvalho route again, doing that you are competing with PL clubs and we will always come off second best. Wolves are the only club who have literally bought promotion, its one hell of a risk. Basically need to be far smarter with recruitment, no more agent recommendations, proper scouting allied to better analytics and looked for untapped potential.

It can be done and Barnsley is a classic example of a club run on a shoestring who now look ahead of us. Its a long term thing though and I dont advocate totally becoming Barnsley and operating on that sort of budget because chances are we get relegated before moving forward.

However off the too of my head here is a list of clubs who have spent a spell in L1 since we were there and therefore had to cut their cloth accordingly: Southampton, Bournemouth, Leicester, Leeds, Burnley, Brighton, Wolves, Norwich. In other words all of those clubs in the last 10 seasons have been in a worse situation than us. All of them have had to adapt and dramatically reduce their costs at some point. All have restructured and through better management have overtaken us to spend time in the Premier league. It can be done.

[Strawberry Avenger]

Football is evolving and now a different game post pane de mic What we need is youngish fast pacey fit players that are fearless and have bags of energy and of course talenented
Unfortunately so is everybody else I hope we can keep Garner and bring back Brennan and integrate mighten and soh not sure how we get over our goal scoring problem though last season we were lucky having lolley ameobi grabban all scoring freely

I think I agree with alot of what you're saying there, Tugger.

Barnsley typify what the Championship has always been about.  High Octane muck and nettles pressing.  They're not without quality.  You need energy, pace and some guile.

We don't seem to have a lot of energy, pace or guile.

SA.

[wassy04]

It's called experience knocker. Experience of getting out of the league we are currently in. It can be valuable.

Too much experience = too old and not hungry enough as we have found out.

Not sure if we have been let down by the likes of Murray, krovinovic and Knockaert have we?

However I see your point SM. We do need to have some experience though but I suppose we need to get the balance right between experience and younger hungry players.

OK but young means expensive and we're already making heavy losses. The majority of the signings past year were done on frees or loans to keep costs down.

So SM what would you do? You want us be be more sustainable, you know the only option we have for that and no-one wants to do that. (Sell worrall) rely on the current squad and hope that CH can dramatically improve them?

Not a dig by the way, I'm interested as I really don't see many good options!

I do get the points you are making but dont agree youth has to mean expensive. For a start wages are much cheaper, I think for example Carvalho our record signing was on £10k/ wk or less. Arter and Colback on £20k/ wk. Thats £2M a year doen the toilet for 2 players who have contributed literally nothing this season.
That doesnt mean we go down the Carvalho route again, doing that you are competing with PL clubs and we will always come off second best. Wolves are the only club who have literally bought promotion, its one hell of a risk. Basically need to be far smarter with recruitment, no more agent recommendations, proper scouting allied to better analytics and looked for untapped potential.

It can be done and Barnsley is a classic example of a club run on a shoestring who now look ahead of us. Its a long term thing though and I dont advocate totally becoming Barnsley and operating on that sort of budget because chances are we get relegated before moving forward.

However off the too of my head here is a list of clubs who have spent a spell in L1 since we were there  and therefore had to cut their cloth accordingly: Southampton, Bournemouth, Leicester, Leeds, Burnley, Brighton, Wolves, Norwich. In other words all of those clubs in the last 10 seasons have been in a worse situation than us. All of them have had to adapt and dramatically reduce their costs at some point. All have restructured and through better management have overtaken us to spend time in the Premier league. It can be done.

That is a fair point on the wages, young players will save on that front, and obviously offer you a likely resale value. Plus you amortise the fees over the length of the contract so would not necessarily be that expensive.

For the record this is pretty much what I'd do.

Re-sign
Christie
Garner (loan)
Knockaert (if loan)
Krovinovic (if loan)

Sign (younger from league one or lower champ)
LB 2-5m
Striker 5-10m
AM either use Brennan Johnson there or another 5m on this position

Rely on current players for the rest of the squad. See if you can get away without selling Worrall.