The Premier League 2023/24

[Sausage Roll]

Not disagreeing with the above comments but worth pointing out that fans of every other PL team had Forest as certainties to drop this season and many will think the same for next too.
Worth thinking about before we start getting cocky and writing newly promoted teams off.

Yup. Already seeing posts on Twitter from people predicting their tables and plenty putting us in the bottom three.

Seems pretty daft to me predicting next season's table before a single player has been bought or sold.

[wassy04]

Not disagreeing with the above comments but worth pointing out that fans of every other PL team had Forest as certainties to drop this season and many will think the same for next too.
Worth thinking about before we start getting cocky and writing newly promoted teams off.

Yeah but a lot of those comments were misinformed and our transfer business was misunderstood, plus we nearly went down still!

Burnley - basically same team as last time they were in the prem minus a few veterans, their star player was a loan player, will they have him? Will they have decent money to spend by the US investors, perhaps? Doesn't guarantee it will be managed well.

Sheff U - Under a transfer embargo until a month or so ago (which seems crazy), bailed out by promotion but clearly issues in the boardroom. Would expect a slow summer although could change if there's a takeover at some point.

Luton - Will have some momentum and be an awkward opponent particularly at home but they had one of the lowest budgets in the championship. Incredible achievement to get promoted and will get some home wins but if we finish below them we are in trouble!

Then you add in financial issues (and a shit team) at Wolves, Bournemouth are similar level to us, Everton may have a points deduction and even without surely won't be able to do loads of business, also I read there were rumours about Dyche being replaced in the summer. Although perhaps that was just someone trying to destabilise them before the final games. 

Brentford, no Toney may lose some players, Fulham potentially could lose a few and the manager. Palace losing Zaha, West Ham may have Euro distractions again. 

I feel like there's lots of opportunities above to finish above at least some of these teams.

What is most scary after writing the above, is right now we could be one of the most stable teams going into the new season in the bottom half. Same manager (hopefully), likely keep all our best players, not tons of incomings, balanced squad that are pretty settled and have some momentum from this season. Surely that'll never last!!

[stefanduma]

Plus Man City with a point deduction.

[Shawoddyred]

Not disagreeing with the above comments but worth pointing out that fans of every other PL team had Forest as certainties to drop this season and many will think the same for next too.
Worth thinking about before we start getting cocky and writing newly promoted teams off.

Yeah but a lot of those comments were misinformed and our transfer business was misunderstood, plus we nearly went down still!

Burnley - basically same team as last time they were in the prem minus a few veterans, their star player was a loan player, will they have him? Will they have decent money to spend by the US investors, perhaps? Doesn't guarantee it will be managed well.

Sheff U - Under a transfer embargo until a month or so ago (which seems crazy), bailed out by promotion but clearly issues in the boardroom. Would expect a slow summer although could change if there's a takeover at some point.

Luton - Will have some momentum and be an awkward opponent particularly at home but they had one of the lowest budgets in the championship. Incredible achievement to get promoted and will get some home wins but if we finish below them we are in trouble!

Then you add in financial issues (and a S**t team) at Wolves, Bournemouth are similar level to us, Everton may have a points deduction and even without surely won't be able to do loads of business, also I read there were rumours about Dyche being replaced in the summer. Although perhaps that was just someone trying to destabilise them before the final games. 

Brentford, no Toney may lose some players, Fulham potentially could lose a few and the manager. Palace losing Zaha, West Ham may have Euro distractions again. 

I feel like there's lots of opportunities above to finish above at least some of these teams.

What is most scary after writing the above, is right now we could be one of the most stable teams going into the new season in the bottom half. Same manager (hopefully), likely keep all our best players, not tons of incomings, balanced squad that are pretty settled and have some momentum from this season. Surely that'll never last!!

Think you've just put the nail in Steve's coffin with statements like that!!! If it happens, it's all your fault....

[zicorice]

We can aim at what we want but if we employ the same attritional low block tactics with our furthest player forward is 30 yards from our goal and expect to score on the break then I think we will have a bottom 5 battle on our hands once again, strengthen or not.

Not so sure about that. Our points gathering has been pretty good since return of Taiwo. 

Stopped conceding cheap goals as often
Been more clinical in opposition  box.

That's a decent recipe.

Just need to work on our away record and we are golden.

Definitely, though saw signs of improvement last 4 away games.

[DR Forest]

Not disagreeing with the above comments but worth pointing out that fans of every other PL team had Forest as certainties to drop this season and many will think the same for next too.
Worth thinking about before we start getting cocky and writing newly promoted teams off.

No one’s getting cocky.
But, there should be three genuine differences next season which give reason to speculate that we can progress whilst having a lit more breathing space over the drop zone.
1. The league itself: it will be weaker this year (towards the bottom). Two, if not all of the promoted teams have low budgets and irrespective of the detail, it’s a massive gap to bridge between the leagues. We should know!
2. Particular circumstances of current rivals: a few are struggling with budgets (as has been pointed out by others) and one of our established rivals not only has financial restrictions but could face a significant points deduction. With that they will particularly struggle to attract players who are better than the ones we can attract. This would be a clear advantage to us next season.
3. Growth at Forest: We are not starting the project from scratch this year. Cooper, the team and EM now have a years’ experience and will improve. We know the owner will back us and we manage FFP closely and will have a stronger budget than several teams this season. We have found some form. We will add quality not quantity. Players now want to join us. The philosophy and recruitment will be joined up. We will trim the chaff and our young team will grow. Taiwo MGW BJ Williams Danilo yates worral mangala can only get better (barring another apocalyptic year of pestilence …. and I’m sure EM’s already had a word with the Twelve Olympians to cover that next season).

Football’s not played on paper but even with a simple assessment of the competition it’s clear to identify this season as an opportunity in which to successfully continue the project.

[Sausage Roll]

We can't take anything for granted though. I bet Huddersfield and Sheffield United said exactly the same as point 3 when they unexpectedly stayed up a few seasons ago.

[wassy04]

We can't take anything for granted though. I bet Huddersfield and Sheffield United said exactly the same as point 3 when they unexpectedly stayed up a few seasons ago.

The difference with those teams and "2nd season syndrome" in general is that teams that come up ride the momentum from the previous year. After a year of that, teams wisen up to them (eg Sheff U) and they actually need better players to continue forward progress.

However, we've already done that bit as we didn't have that momentum due to the 30 new players. In fact our momentum only started about a month ago, so I'd argue we're in a better spot than most would be to avoid that scenario. Again it's unprecedented as no-one has stayed up before with that kind of turnover.

[Madforit]

We can't take anything for granted though. I bet Huddersfield and Sheffield United said exactly the same as point 3 when they unexpectedly stayed up a few seasons ago.

The difference with those teams and "2nd season syndrome" in general is that teams that come up ride the momentum from the previous year. After a year of that, teams wisen up to them (eg Sheff U) and they actually need better players to continue forward progress.

However, we've already done that bit as we didn't have that momentum due to the 30 new players. In fact our momentum only started about a month ago, so I'd argue we're in a better spot than most would be to avoid that scenario. Again it's unprecedented as no-one has stayed up before with that kind of turnover.

Totally agree ^

[Username]

I bet the other 17 teams looked at us, Fulham and Bournemouth and thought we were nailed on for relegation this season.

One basket case and two clubs destined to yo-yo

[zicorice]

We can't take anything for granted though. I bet Huddersfield and Sheffield United said exactly the same as point 3 when they unexpectedly stayed up a few seasons ago.

The difference with those teams and "2nd season syndrome" in general is that teams that come up ride the momentum from the previous year. After a year of that, teams wisen up to them (eg Sheff U) and they actually need better players to continue forward progress.

However, we've already done that bit as we didn't have that momentum due to the 30 new players. In fact our momentum only started about a month ago, so I'd argue we're in a better spot than most would be to avoid that scenario. Again it's unprecedented as no-one has stayed up before with that kind of turnover.

I have a concern that is growing the more I read: we stayed up by first and foremost shutting the back door. By necessity we defended in numbers and hit teams on the break. So far so good. In fact if we'd played this way from the off we may have picked up a few more points.

Here's my worry. Alot of people are talking about being less defensive/more expansive etc. Unless we go out and sign some seriously high class players we don't have the personnel. I love that at different times this season various centre backs have really stepped up. Even Cook at start of our 1st good run (especially vs Brighton and Liverpool), Boly, Mckenna, Felipe, Niakhate and Worrall have all had stand out periods, but also all have dropped clangers. 

I don't believe any combination of those 2 would be secure enough to allow a complete change of style. Any 3 maybe, but we probably have no Lodi holding up our left side either. Then up top, I love Taiwo, but as much as he has improved with his back to goal (hours put in at training ground ground) he's still fairly average at hold up play for a Premier league CF, His strength is going towards goal.

I worry we'd be comprising some of our strengths, was it Stoke (obviously not saying our style mirrors theres) who decided years of being solid and comfortable wanted to "be more attractive " and promptly went down and so far stay down.

That said, Cooper will know best and hopefully be supported in what he wants.

[Plymouth red]

I bet the other 17 teams looked at us, Fulham and Bournemouth and thought we were nailed on for relegation this season.

One basket case and two clubs destined to yo-yo

My thoughts exactly. I was going to post exact same sentiments. Underestimate anyone in this league. I reckon Luton could take a few scalps, particularly at their ground.